The transcripts of the trial of Charles Taylor, former President of Liberia. More…

  • Sir, I would like to begin by reminding you about your testimony on 1 June. So if we could have page 41771, please, put on the screen. Do you remember, Mr Witness, you told us that you learned about the threat against you by Foday Sankoh, that he had told the fighters that you had embezzled money from Sam Bockarie?

  • Yes, your Honour. Before I go further, please, I want to rectify one thing that we left yesterday which was concerning the bodyguard that was shot. And I want to give you the correct name. It's Bakundu.

  • Thank you very much. Now, is that one word?

  • Bakundu. You can write that to be accepted, your Honour.

  • Can you help us with the spelling?

  • Sir, do you know if that is his family name or a nickname?

  • That is the real family - his surname.

  • Okay. Thank you very much.

  • I see the transcript. Is it on the screen? I don't have it. Yes, it is. So, sir, on 1 June, two days ago, you were asked by the Presiding Judge, Madam President, at line 4:

    "PRESIDING JUDGE: If I may inquire, at what stage,

    Mr Witness, did you speak to Sam Bockarie?

  • I spoke to him facially, your Honour.

  • Yes, at what stage did you speak to him

    facially? Was this in 1996 or in 1997?

  • 1997, your Lord."

    So, sir, before you met Foday Sankoh, you had been warned by Sam Bockarie about what Sankoh had been saying about you, correct?

  • And this was in 1997, correct?

  • It was in Monrovia, or where?

  • It was in Monrovia.

  • And what was Sam Bockarie doing there?

  • He went to negotiate for the resident of the people that were supposed to have been selected to go for any outside negotiation.

  • So he went to negotiate with who?

  • He went to negotiate because he was called personally by His Excellency Olusegun Obasanjo.

  • Yes, sir.

  • Where did you actually see him? Where in Monrovia?

  • I met him at a hotel in Monrovia.

  • This hotel is located on the main road. We call it a boulevard.

  • The Boulevard Hotel, correct?

  • And am I correct that that has changed its name?

  • Well, I can't tell now because it has taken a longer time, my Lord.

  • Mr Koumjian, I don't understand. When the witness says, "He went to negotiate for the resident of the people that were supposed to have been selected to go for any outside negotiation", what does that mean?

  • He went to negotiate for the external delegation's resident, because at that time they had not given a permanent place where they should be.

  • In Monrovia, Madame.

  • And this was at the request of who?

  • His Excellency Olusegun Obasanjo.

  • Why would Olusegun Obasanjo, the President of Nigeria, be concerned with the residences in Liberia?

  • No, he was the man that was negotiating at that time. He was the leading negotiator from the international community who volunteered to take the initiative of bringing - making a corridor for us to be going to any meeting that will be called by the international committee.

  • Sir, how did you know to go to that hotel to meet Bockarie?

  • I was on my way to town. Then I saw him at the gate and I was able to go to meet him. That was even unfortunate, because I had never had the intention of seeing him. So I saw him there and he called me, and I re-tell the story.

  • So you saw him at the gate to White Flower when you were passing by?

  • Not White Flower, my Lord. I said his hotel.

  • When you say "the gate", what did you mean?

  • The gate of the hotel.

  • Was Bockarie staying at the hotel?

  • He was staying there, yes, my Lord.

  • Now, after Bockarie greeted you, he invited you in to speak to him?

  • Well, he didn't invite me directly. I only greeted him, How are you, sir? and he said yes. And I said - he asked me, Why are you still here? I told him I came on a mission to get arms and ammunition. He said, Yes, do not explain. I have already heard - I mean, I heard it from the leader, and he went in and told us that you have embezzled the money that he gave to you.

  • So where was this conversation with Bockarie?

  • Just at that same gate, my Lord.

  • And then what happened?

  • After that I told him that, Mr Bockarie, I know what they call RUF, and I know who is a fighter, and I am a trained fighter - and though I was not trained to be holding arms - but I am a trained man. I know the repercussion that you would take if I go in. This had made me to be here. Then he narrated that Foday Sankoh really told them that I have embezzled this money to escape - I mean, he wanted - Foday Sankoh wanted to escape the fighters. So he put me on the book that I had been the person that have taken the money, and I have gone out and he doesn't know my whereabouts, which I felt was something that he was almost giving my life.

  • So what happened after Bockarie told you that?

  • Well, I stayed in Monrovia.

  • But you just had the conversation at the gate and then continued on your way?

  • Yes, my Lord. I had nothing else, because he didn't ask me to go in. He also praised that I should stay because he is not able to control the boys, if I do go upon what Foday Sankoh has told him.

  • Sir, where you frightened when you saw Sam Bockarie?

  • Seriously I was frightened, because it took a longer time - when I left from 1996, he never saw me. In fact, I had the intention that he was going to arrest me. So I was not really - I was panicking when I was even talking to him.

  • So after you - after that conversation, did you try to remain hidden in Monrovia?

  • Yes, my Lord. In the sense I was in hiding, because I never used to go around wheresoever. I mean, I never used to go around town because I was afraid. I could even meet - not even Sam Bockarie, but it could be those that also entered with Mike Lamin.

  • Mr Koumjian, the witness, when you asked him, "So what happened after Bockarie told you that?" his answer was, "They went back." Who went back where. Mr Witness, that's a question for you. What did you mean, "They went back"?

  • Yes, Madam President, I understood that they were going the next day, and I also left for my - for my house.

  • You haven't answered my question. Who is "they" and where did they go back to?

  • Back to Sierra Leone.

  • Who is "they"?

  • At the day I saw only him, but I know he cannot walk alone. So if we can change the "they" to "he", because he was the one I saw, then it could be better, Madam President. But he went back. He told me officially that he was going back to Buedu.

  • So, sir, was this the extent of the conversation: You were passing outside the hotel, greeted Bockarie. He asked what you were doing, and you explained what you were doing in Monrovia, and then he said he knew about it because Foday Sankoh had told the fighters that you had embezzled money, and then he told you to - it's better for you to stay in Monrovia. Was that the entire conversation?

  • That was the end of that conversation, my Lord.

  • Given that conversation, you didn't stop and chat about politics with Sam Bockarie, did you?

  • I didn't, my Lord.

  • So, sir, how is it that you told us that Sam Bockarie was there on the invitation of Obasanjo? What reason would you have to know what Sam Bockarie was there for?

  • Well, he didn't - he only told me that he was there upon the request of Obasanjo because I was not with them. Had I been with them, my Lord, I think I would have been in that convoy.

  • Sir, you just gave us - we just went through the conversation, and you never said anything about Sam Bockarie explained why he was there. Why would Sam Bockarie tell you what he was doing in Monrovia?

  • Sam Bockarie told me that he came there purposely to make sure if he can get a place for any delegation and he would be there for only 72 hours and he has to go back. That was what he told me, my Lord.

  • So Sam Bockarie was telling you he was in Monrovia in order to obtain a permanent office in Monrovia. Is that right?

  • You are right, my Lord.

  • Now, sir, the next time you saw Foday Sankoh, after this incident about him giving you money to buy weapons in Monrovia, was when, you told us, after Lome, correct?

  • And you met him in Monrovia, correct?

  • Sending me to purchase - I never met him in Monrovia. My Lord, I told you I was with him in Ivory Coast.

  • Okay, sir, you are not following me, so maybe it's my fault. Let me make it clear to you. After Lome you met Foday Sankoh again in Monrovia, correct?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • On that occasion, after Lome, so it would be 1999, where did you meet Foday Sankoh? Where in Monrovia?

  • Yes, my Lord, I met him in a lodge located at Congo Town on the left. If you are coming towards ELWA and when you are going to town you find that lodge on the left-hand side when you are going to town. But when you are coming from town, it is on the right-hand side. It's a lodge.

  • So, sir, when you say the lodge, is it the same place you talked about where the external delegation, when you worked for them, had the office with the radio communication set?

  • And you told us that was about 300 metres from White Flower in Congo Town, correct?

  • I have been puzzling over this again because that distance is further, my Lord. It's further.

  • So, sir, how was it that you came to this RUF office, given that you were hiding out from the RUF, how was it that in 1999 you went to that office?

  • Thank you, my Lord. I was at that time doing my profession, doing my work, and I saw a black car and in this black car was Sam Bockarie, Jackson and Rashid Foday. When I saw them, of course I was up the stairs, the second floor, they said somebody wanted to see me. One of the {redacted} came up from the {redacted} indicated somebody wanted to see me. I came to the corridor of the second floor and I saw him and I came back. I was panicked with the intention maybe I know that he has been a leader of the RUF in the absence of Foday Sankoh. So I decided really that I wouldn't come down easily. So yet I know that he is a brother, so I came down. I met him and I told him, "Sam Bockarie, what is your problem? What have you come to do to this {redacted}?" He said --

  • Before we carry on can I just ask again out of an abundance of caution to have the references that identify the witness's profession or enable his profession to be identified to be redacted.

  • Yes, I do agree. Madam Court Manager, in the last paragraph of this evidence there is a reference to an official and a reference to an institution, please redact them. The members of the public are not to repeat those words outside of court.

  • Sir, I want you to continue with what you are saying, but just remember you just have to talk about the place you work without further identifying it. So you said that Sam Bockarie came in a car with Jackson and Rashid Foday and you came downstairs from your workplace. Continue.

  • When I came down, I greeted him and I asked him what was his purpose and he told me that Foday Sankoh wanted to see me at this lodge. I got in the car and we came directly. And when I came to the car to know that I have been put to a picture of risk in my life, which already Sam Bockarie narrated previously, I came to realise that I was ignored to even enter immediately. And that is to enter the lodge. I stayed at the gate for over 15 minutes. His bodyguard, that is Foday Sankoh's bodyguards, having been told that I have embezzled money, they kept me out for 15 minutes. After the 15 minutes, Shek Nabieu came and told me - he greeted me, but even in greeting could tell that there was something hidden. So I stayed there for 20 minutes. Then I was invited in again. I entered the yard again. To see Foday Sankoh again was a problem. I was threatened heavily by his bodyguards. They were saying that, "You took the money for the RUF and you went back. You will see," threatening remarks. But I couldn't talk because there were many.

    Now, I entered the parlour where Foday Sankoh was after I have been there for one hour waiting. Entering, I saw him, I greeted him as usual. Then he told me, I mean he laughed and he told me, "Were you afraid," in Krio, and I told him, "Yes, I should be afraid." He said, "Okay, everything is over. I have decided to call you so that we can talk," because the parlour was full of his bodyguards and other dignitaries like Eddie, Abdul Razak and the others.

    So I sat down for ten minutes on that parlour and there was a place that was made - that when you entered there you are talking, the other people that are seated in the sitting room will not hear you. So he called Jackson, he called Sam Bockarie. Immediately we went, before even he could sit down he embraced me and stated these words, this was said to Sam Bockarie directly, "Among you I have respect for this man. All what I went and said over there about his name, I was escaping you people. You, the fighters. So it is true I gave him the money and the money was received and I got a communication from the ECOMOG man even when I was in Ivory Coast that he delivered the money. Therefore, my, brother, I am sorry for whatsoever happened. But in your absence, Sam Bockarie has always been pleading and he has always been telling me that I am not talking about any other person, but this particular individual can never, never embezzle any money in RUF." And he said it twice.

    So Foday Sankoh said, "I believe you have heard it and this man has always been pleading on your behalf. So you have come back. I'm sorry. But, Sam Bockarie, this is directly for you, you are fighters, but while I am sending this individual back to Sierra Leone, I wouldn't like to hear that he has even a scrap or he is beaten by anybody or intimidated. After that, you should be giving him hundred dollars even month until I will give you orders to go with him to Freetown" --

  • Sir, you mentioned a Shek. Can you tell us - we didn't get the name. Can you explain it?

  • The last name, please?

  • Do you know how to spell that?

  • N-A-B-I-E-U.

  • And when you talk about Jackson, that's Jackson Swarray?

  • Jackson Swarray, yes, my Lord.

  • Sir, you were in hiding in Monrovia, you told us. So how is it that Sam Bockarie knew where you worked?

  • Well, at this time, my Lord, the people that were already residing, that was Rashid one time he was going to ELWA, he just met me, he was in his car, so he met me and asked me, "Where are you?" I couldn't hide on those people because I have heard it that they are already in Monrovia. So when I met him I told him that I am residing in this small house and I am working.

  • Sir, you knew Foday Sankoh well over the years. You knew him even as Pa Morlai and you knew him up until the time he was arrested in May 2000, correct?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • What did Foday Sankoh tell you about how he knew Charles Taylor?

  • Foday Sankoh, when we left - when we - when the fighters, RUF, was trained he didn't tell us about Charles Taylor until he was in Pendembu. When we reached Pendembu, he told us he has a friend and he told us his name is Charles Taylor. And he told us that his relationship, my Lord, has nothing to do with his own struggle. And he is struggling, he is fighting by himself and he will provide whatsoever he has because he has no money. This was a repetitive statement from Foday Sankoh. So that was the time I came to know the name, to hear the name from him, because I knew Charles Taylor before.

  • How did you know Charles Taylor before?

  • Well, even I was there when his elections went on. I was there when the war ended in Liberia. I stayed there and one time I was passing in fact there was an occasion, if I can remember, my Lord, was an occasion for his 49th birthday. During that time I saw him, but we were very far from him. He was celebrating that and he came out to the corridor, spoke to everybody.

  • He came out from what corridor?

  • His house to the corridor. He has a house that he was living in that was not the new house that we are calling White Flower.

  • So he came out from the house when you say he came out from the corridor?

  • He came out to the corridor.

  • So you were in the house?

  • I was not in that house. It was something that was announced that the President was celebrating his birthday. So it was a public invitation that was given, or everybody is invited, so I was in there in Monrovia. So I went around and just because I have not seen Charles Taylor before, so I met him there and I saw him. But we were very far off from the location of his house.

  • So Foday Sankoh told you this at Pendembu, you mean when you captured Pendembu in 1991. Is that right?

  • So that would have been about April or May 1991?

  • My Lord, I think we can take it that way because his first visit was immediately we entered we captured Koindu he visited us. He never visited us until we captured Pendembu. So that took a longer time, my Lord.

  • Well, how much time?

  • Well, let's say it took about five months. Let's say about five months it was we captured Pendembu.

  • And why did Foday Sankoh tell you, "I have a friend but he doesn't do anything for me"? I don't understand that conversation. Can you explain it?

  • Excuse me, my Lord. Not that he hasn't done anything for me. He said, "He has nothing to do with my struggle. My friendship with Charles Taylor has nothing to do with the struggle. That's the fighting I have brought you people for. He is just my friend."

  • Well, sir, I presume Foday Sankoh had hundreds of friends, correct? Or at least dozens?

  • He should be because, I mean, if we look at it, my Lord, based upon what he told me about himself, he could have friends because, I mean, he was a photographer. So each time he does that, I think he was creating an avenue for friendship.

  • So why was he discussing this one friend, Charles Taylor, to you in Pendembu?

  • Well, that one - that question, my Lord, I didn't - I can't answer that, because he only told us about the man - this man.

  • Now, sir, I want to go back to your meetings with Charles Taylor. So if we could have, please, a transcript for 1 June, page 41787. So, sir, on 1 June, two days ago, you were asked about this meeting. "What year did this meeting take place in?" And you said, "This was in 1999." You were asked what month the meeting took place, and you said it was after September. You then said - were asked, was it then after you had returned to Sierra Leone to the RUF? And you said, no, I was residing there in Monrovia. So then you were asked, Who invited you to the meeting? And you said:

    "The meeting itself was called by Charles Taylor, and he told us that I have called you, my brothers, so that I can explain my own part."

    So, sir, I then asked you a few lines down:

    "A. My question was: Who invited you - I am talking about

    you as an individual - to this meeting?

    Q. I individually, I was already the head of the external

    delegation in Monrovia, so I was invited."

    My question to you, sir, is how did you get that invitation? How did you know to go to White Flower?

  • Thank you very much, my Lord. I got this invitation directly from a young man at that time known as Momo Dgiba. He came to the house and said that - at that time, direct words from him were that I have come and I have been sent by the Old Man - that is, the Old Man - to come and ask you that you would be going to White Flower to meet him this evening.

  • If we could go on to page 41793. I want to read from line 23 of what you said two days ago. You were asked:

    "Q. Who went to the meeting at White Flower?

    A. I was present. Sam Bockarie was there. Gibril

    Massaquoi was there, and Issa Sesay was there."

    Is that a correct and complete list of those who met with Charles Taylor at White Flower?

  • No, your Honour.

  • Who else was there?

  • Benjamin Yeaten.

  • Anyone else?

  • That was the number. The other one was a bodyguard, of course, Charles Taylor. I don't know his name.

  • What is that surname again? Patrick who?

  • Patrick Beinda, B-E-I-N-D-A.

  • Sir, how about Morris Kallon; was he there?

  • No, my Lord. Yes, my Lord, please allow me to also state that - oh, I have that. I have that. Issa Sesay was in that meeting. Okay. That's there. Thank you, my Lord.

  • But Morris Kallon was not there?

  • If we could have yesterday's transcript, page 41978, and I just want to go to the end of this page starting at line 24. You were relating what Charles Taylor said, and you said Charles Taylor said:

    "'Old man,'" referring to you, "'the other old man', which was Pa Beinda, he said, 'You people are lacking experience here. I want to ask you who is here among you, the people that are seated here, including Sam Bockarie, Issa Sesay, Morris Kallon, and all other leaders that have ever given me a cent?'"

    So, sir, were you confused because you have attended much more than one meeting with Charles Taylor? That's why you're confused about who was in attendance and whether Morris Kallon was at this meeting, correct?

  • Yes, my Lord. I need to explain that, why I included here Morris Kallon. Now, that was the statement directly from Charles Taylor, because he knew these people when they were even the hierarchy, that is, the executive of the - so he included. He said, well, even those that are not here, like Morris Kallon and the others, they are not here. But you people that are here, I want to ask you. That was why I included; not that Morris Kallon was in that meeting.

  • Sir, who is Musa Cisse? You know him, don't you?

  • Musa Cisse, yes, my Lord, I know him.

  • He was Charles Taylor's chief of protocol, correct?

  • You met him in the Ivory Coast, correct?

  • Tell us when was it that you met him in the Ivory Coast?

  • Well, when there were - I mean, Foday Sankoh invited our wives or our families to come to Abidjan, Foday Sankoh indicated to us that he has already made a place where the external delegation is presently residing. This external delegation included Deen-Jalloh, Dr Barrie, Fayia Musa and his wife and Philip Palmer, and therefore we should call - I mean, he is calling upon Palmer to go and collect the wives of the people that he captured or he got from Liberia. So after these people came, they didn't come directly to Abidjan. My wife, including Philip - including Prince Taylor and Lawrence Womandia, were told to go to the place where the delegation was staying. This was in Musa Cisse's house. So they stayed there for two days and they were, I mean, taken from there for them to meet us in Abidjan.

  • Who stayed in Musa Cisse's house?

  • The external delegation was staying there.

  • And this was in Danane or Abidjan?

  • Danane, my Lord.

  • And that's how you met Musa Cisse, correct?

  • Now, sir, you have talked in your testimony about a document called Footpaths to Democracy. You know that document, correct?

  • It was written by Addai-Sebo, who you also knew; is that correct?

  • And who is Addai-Sebo?

  • Addai-Sebo was a friend that was saying - that was helping us from the international community directly under the auspices of International Alert.

  • You first met him in Zogoda or in this - somewhere in Sierra Leone, correct?

  • I met Addai in Kailahun District, yes, My Lord.

  • When you first met him he was saying he was a journalist, correct?

  • And you learned eventually he was a friend of Charles Taylor, correct?

  • At that time, no, I didn't know that he was a friend, my Lord.

  • But you do now, correct?

  • I didn't know. He only came and said that he was a journalist and has come to get the coverage of our incursion.

  • Do you know that Addai-Sebo was a friend of Charles Taylor?

  • I didn't know that, my Lord.

  • I want to be clear about your answer, because I am not asking you what you knew when you met him. I am asking you what you know today. Do you know that Addai-Sebo was a friend of Charles Taylor?

  • Sir, were you present when the RUF launched the Footpaths to Democracy when they publicised it while in Ivory Coast?

  • My Lord, I was not present. That was the time - it was after that I met Addai-Sebo in Ivory Coast.

  • The money that you used to buy a ticket to Europe, that was money given by Charles Taylor, correct?

  • Sir, I want to go to the testimony from

    {redacted}. Is that correct?

  • What his last name?

  • That is Fayia Musa. Musa is the last name.

  • Okay. Sir, did you buy the ticket, or did he buy the ticket, or did you buy it together?

  • The ticket was bought together and we travelled.

  • So going to {redacted} I am going to start to read from line 4. {Redacted}.

  • Mr Koumjian, we don't want to run into the problems we ran into yesterday, so I think you may have to reconsider the way you present this testimony.

  • So it should not be on the screen broadcast, the transcript, please. And if it has been, I would ask for a redaction if it's been broadcast publicly.

  • Well, I think the reference - the danger is in the reference to the date and the page of an open transcript.

  • I will come back to this later in closed session.

  • Can I ask for all of that to be redacted in the same way that we redacted yesterday; in other words, those references to that page and those line.

  • Certainly. Madam Court Manager.

  • Your Honour, I do have a one or two short matters to cover in private session. Perhaps this would be a good time to ask for that, including this matter.

  • We will go into a brief private session to hear evidence that is likely to reveal the identity of this witness, who is a protected witness.

    Madam Court Manager, please.

  • [At this point in the proceedings, a portion of the transcript, pages 42017 to 42029, was extracted and sealed under separate cover, as the proceeding was heard in private session.]

  • [Open session]

  • Your Honour, we are in open session.

  • Or perhaps not. We don't need to name the witness. Just simply - well --

  • I'm afraid if we refer to the document and give any references, then it will identify the witness. So that would have to be done either in a different way or in private session.

  • Mr Koumjian, you have applied for, I don't know which of these pages you want marked.

  • Are we in private session?

  • Not necessarily, because I don't believe that just referring to a page would reveal the identity of the witness, no.

  • Madam President --

  • I just need to know the pages of the document behind tab 3 that you want us to admit. Just the pages, please.

  • Only the two pages that I referred to and perhaps those that precede them in order to show where they are found in the document.

  • The witness is named on those pages. That was my point.

  • Your Honour, I could hand to the usher the exact pages that we seek to be marked, which would include the cover pages and the particular pages that I quoted from.

  • I think that would be helpful. I am certainly rummaging through a number of pages here.

  • Perhaps I think I can safely just explain that both quotes were from the same volume, so we have the cover page for the volume and then specific cover pages for the chapters. One cover page for the volume.

  • I am going to do it this way: The document behind tab 3, that is the Sierra Leone Truth and Reconciliation Commission, and we are going to mark page 61 of chapter 2 volume 3B of that report, and the cover page of volume 3B, so those go together. That is going to be MFI-6A. I don't know if you want that confidential.

  • I not only want it confidential, I would like this done privately for the reasons I have now cited twice; that witness's name was on the page of this document.

  • Yes, but, Mr Munyard, if you look at that page, there is more than one name named.

  • I appreciate that, your Honour. There is only a handful of names.

  • Yes, and that's good enough. It's good enough unless you keep harping at it and then of course for the record everybody can see.

  • Well, I was criticised yesterday for not harping if I can use, Madam President, your word.

  • That was a different circumstance. The second set of pages that we want to mark is chapter 4 volume 3B, and that would be page 304 and the cover page accompanying that. So that will be MFI-6B.

    Actually, MFI-6A and 6B need not be confidential in our opinion. In any event, the testimony that was elicited out of these pages was in private session and that is enough to protect the witness.

  • Sir, you talked about One Man One as being one of the principal trainers at Naama there with you at the base throughout the training, correct?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • And if we can just review your testimony from 1 June, page 41711, briefly. You said in answer to a question about eight lines down - you were asked by Defence counsel:

    "Q. Any other names of any other people that you were

    involved with who were trainers at Naama?

    A. There were some other people, but these people were

    brought directly by the same Pa Morlai who came with two

    other men. They brought them in and they said, 'This is

    One Man One. His name should not be disclosed.' In fact,

    he didn't disclose any name. He said, 'This is One Man One

    and he's a brother and he's going to be here to monitor

    your affairs.'"

    Is that correct, what you said on 1 June?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • Sir, there have been other witnesses in this case who discussed One Man One. If we could have the testimony from 11 May 2010, please, page 40818. This is the testimony from an NPFL fighter, Mr Zaymay. He was asked on line 14:

    "Q. Do you know anyone by the name or alias of One Man


    A. Yes.

    Q. Who was One Man One?"

    Line 24:

    "A. One Man One was Alpha Company commander. He was

    assigned to Tiene and Bo Waterside, the border between

    Sierra Leone and Liberia.

    Q. And over what period was One Man One assigned to this

    place Tiene and Bo Waterside?

    A. When I took over in February 1991 up to the end of 1991

    when I was transferred, he was still in command."

    So, sir, this instructor - you left the base, the RUF, in March 1991. In February 1991, he is a commander for the NPFL Alpha Company at Tiene and Bo Waterside. You knew he was an NPFL fighter when he was at the base, didn't you?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • Sir, a quick question: Is Issa Sesay a credible person? Is he someone who tells the truth?

  • Your Honour, I have to say that Issa Sesay is not a credible man.

  • You have seen him lie when it was in his interest to do so, haven't you?

  • Sir, on 8 May there was an incident at Foday Sankoh's house in Freetown. Do you recall that? And after that incident, about a week later, Foday Sankoh was arrested. Do you recall that?

  • My Lord, I was not in Freetown.

  • Where were you then?

  • At that time I was right in Buedu.

  • 8 May of which year are you referring to?

  • 8 May 2000 you were in Buedu?

  • I was in Buedu, yes, sir.

  • Do you recall this incident where some people were killed outside of the Spur Road house of Foday Sankoh in Freetown?

  • This was revealed to us by Gibril Massaquoi. He sent a radio message to all the stations that were under the supervision of the RUFP, my Lord.

  • Now, Gibril Massaquoi was also in the house with Foday Sankoh during - just wait for me to finish so that the gentleman can type one of us at a time. Sir, Gibril Massaquoi was in the house with Foday Sankoh when this 8 May incident occurred, correct?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • Superman, Dennis Mingo, was also in the house, correct?

  • They, along with Foday Sankoh, escaped from the house on 8 May, correct?

  • But Superman and Gibril were able to make their way to Makeni while Foday Sankoh was not, isn't that correct?

  • He was arrested in the hills about a week later, correct?

  • When Gibril and Superman showed up in Makeni, they gave certain instructions from Foday Sankoh, correct?

  • I was not in Makeni when they arrived.

  • Okay. Issa Sesay was in Makeni when they arrived, correct?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • After they arrived you said there was a radio message sent out by Gibril Massaquoi, correct?

  • And in the radio message, what did the radio message say?

  • Directly it was an information that was given that Foday Sankoh's house was attacked and Gibril Massaquoi and Superman decided to come - to escape with Foday Sankoh but they couldn't do it because of the right word - the word he used on Foday Sankoh is that the Pa is selfish. And we told him to go out. He said he was not going anywhere, so we have left him there.

  • Now, sir, after they arrived in Makeni, Superman was made the number two to Issa Sesay in the RUF military command, correct?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • And they were working together after 8 May 2000, correct?

  • Superman led troops into Guinea, correct?

  • Those were RUF troops, correct?

  • Now I am sure this wasn't in the radio message that was sent out, but in your position did you learn of instructions that Foday Sankoh sent to Issa Sesay through Gibril and Superman that Foday Sankoh told Issa Sesay, "Take all instructions from Charles Taylor"?

  • I never heard it, your Honour.

  • Superman later led troops fighting in Lofa County, correct?

  • And that's where he died. Isn't that true?

  • Now, sir - I will ask that the witness be shown P-28, please. Sir, you told us you worked for many - for years with Issa Sesay, and you previously identified his signature. I want to show you another document and ask you to look at the signature. If that could be put on the screen?

  • I am going on recollection now, and I might be wrong, but I thought the witness was asked if he would have recognised Foday Sankoh's signature. As I say, I will be corrected if I am wrong, but that's my recollection of the earlier questioning about recognising signatures.

  • I believe, your Honour, it was the first confidential document that this witness said he wrote, and the witness's own name and signature appears. There is a stamp, and he recognised under the stamp the signature of Issa Sesay.

  • I stand corrected.

  • Sir, you see at the bottom of the page a signature. Is that the signature - there is two. But in blue ink, the one on top, is that the signature of Issa Sesay?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • Thank you, sir. Let me just - sorry, before we leave that document just a quick question. This is a - P-28 is a document labelled "operational order" and there's some names I want to ask you about. First in paragraph 3, Major General Matthew Barbu. I may be pronouncing it wrong. Do you recognise the name Matthew Barbu?

  • Yeah. The sound - correct sound for that is Barbu, B-A-R-B-U.

  • Matthew Barbu was a Liberian member of the RUF, correct?

  • He was a vanguard, correct?

  • Thank you. I want to ask you just to clarify something from your previous testimony. That would be from the transcript of 1 June, please, page 41739, line 7, where the Defence counsel asked you:

    "Q. Right. So I just want to you to explain to the judges

    in simple terms. The RUF goes into Koindu. You come in as

    part of the executive. You are taken and shown a shop

    where there is rice. Is the shopkeeper still there, the


    A. The shopkeeper was later - he was later captured.

    Q. Right.

    A. But at the initial point he escaped for survival."

    Sir, why was the shopkeeper captured?

  • After we captured Koindu, this shopkeeper, by right name - he is now dead - Alhaji Kamara, was the owner of the shop. He escaped with his family in the bush. Later, your Honour, there was an operation that the commander asked for, that is, Sylvester and Mongor. They said that they should find - the surroundings should be - I mean, should be checked for civilians that ran away or make sure that there is no enemy around us. With that concept they gave one squad, that's 15 fighters, and this Pa Kamara was met about 3 miles outside Koindu, and he was captured there and brought to town, where he told the fighters that the shop was his own, together with the hotel.

  • Sir, he was a civilian, correct?

  • Well, why capture him?

  • Maybe that might be a strong word, my Lord to say "capture", but, I mean, when the town was - well, fell under the fighters, I mean, they went in search of the civilians and whosoever might be to make sure they were safe in the area. That's why I am using the word "capture".

  • You said he escaped for survival, and then you said 15 men were sent - fighters out to capture him, correct?

  • Not to capture him alone. I said, my Lord, they went to make sure that they could find, if possible, any civilian that was around there so that they can be brought to town. And he was in a small bush in a village 3 miles from Koindu. There they saw him sitting down. Then they asked him; he said he was Alhaji Kamara.

  • Were you one of those who captured him?

  • I was in Koindu.

  • How do you know he was sitting down, if you were not one of those that captured him?

  • For every operation, the fighters will come back to my office, which was an emergency office where the battle group commander lived. They would come there, the commanders will get the information, and they would pass it over to us.

  • Sir, it doesn't make sense that fighters would come back and say, "I found this man in a small bush and he was sitting down." You were there when he was captured, weren't you?

  • I was not present, my Lord. I am not a fighter. Fighters were asked to always - I had no gun holding. So the fighters were always asked to make sure that enemies are not around us.

  • And you - the RUF stole all of the rice in his store, correct?

  • Sir, I want to go back to your mission in 1996 when you were sent from the Ivory Coast by Foday Sankoh to buy ammunition in Monrovia. Now, you told us that Foday Sankoh told you about that mission - gave you that mission when he was in Ivory Coast, correct?

  • Were you in Danane when he gave you this order?

  • No, my Lord. I was with him in a hotel called Hotel Ivoire.

  • Yes, when he gave me the mission, he couldn't complete there. We came because of the manner in which Foday Sankoh was always asked - I mean, acting. The international community got annoyed and Amara Essy, His Excellency, at that time the Foreign Minister, got annoyed and they told him to get out of the hotel.

  • Now, sir, Foday Sankoh - this is 1996. This is - you said it was about November 1996, correct?

  • So this is as the Abidjan Peace Accord is about to be signed, correct?

  • Now, Foday Sankoh, after going back and forth from Gbarnga to Kailahun District, when ULIMO closed the border in late '92 or 1993, Foday Sankoh same to stay in Sierra Leone, correct?

  • And he was there in Kailahun and then when the army - the SLAs pushed you out of the towns he went to the bush, eventually based in Zogoda in Kenema District, correct?

  • So he hadn't been in Monrovia certainly during those years since the road was closed by ULIMO, correct?

  • To your knowledge - but he did have radio communications that could reach Liberia, correct?

  • Yes, my Lord. At that time we had some radios that we - was operating in his house.

  • And the RUF was working closely with Musa Cisse, who became Charles Taylor's chief of protocol, correct?

  • The RUF - no, my Lord.

  • Well, sir, you said that people - the external delegation was staying at Musa Cisse's house?

  • Can we have a time frame for the scope of these questions?

  • Sir, Musa Cisse is a person who was an expert in arranging arms deals; isn't that true?

  • Well, I don't know that on him, my Lord.

  • Well, sir, Charles Taylor - I don't know if you followed his testimony - testified he used Musa Cisse to arrange arms deals and bribe officials in other countries to allow arms to come through. Did you know that?

  • Mr Koumjian, there was a query about time frames, and I thought you were going to provide time frames for the questions that you asked before.

  • I am not sure which question a time frame is asked. When he was in Abidjan, we have testimony already from the witness. He said he was given this mission in March 1996. He said he was sent to the Ivory Coast in 1996, and that's when he would - first was in Ivory Coast:

  • Isn't that correct, sir?

  • Yes, but we then went back to Camp Zogoda, and that's why the time suddenly started to appear to be going backwards and forwards. I would be grateful if my learned friend would say when he is suggesting the RUF were in touch with Musa Cisse.

  • Sir, you met Musa Cisse in 1996 in Ivory Coast, correct?

  • When did you meet him?

  • Oh, Musa Cisse, I only met him in Danane.

  • There was an answer - or a question, actually, where you - Mr Koumjian, you said to the witness, well, sir, you said that people - that the external delegation was staying at Musa Cisse's house, and the answer said yes. Now, can we have a time frame for that?

  • Sir, that question is for you. He told us earlier this morning that - when I asked you about Musa Cisse, you said external delegation was staying at his house, I believe you said when you were sent out to Ivory Coast, correct?

  • That was - when was that?

  • I was send to Ivory Coast in March, finally, when I came with the leader. I stayed there until March. April this delegation was asked to come to Monrovia - sorry, Monrovia - come to Ivory Coast, Abidjan. They were in Danane and they were asked by Foday Sankoh that he has come to Abidjan, and therefore the external delegation should move to Abidjan.

  • You were in the Ivory Coast from March, you said, 1996. You left to go on your mission to purchase ammo from Monrovia just before the Lome - Abidjan Peace Accord was signed, correct?

  • You were in Monrovia when the accord was signed on 30 November 1996, correct?

  • How long before you left - how long were you in the Ivory Coast before your first trip to Monrovia on that mission? You said you went twice?

  • The first time I went was the same November when the money - the first money was given to me, that was the 20,000 US dollars. I left and I went to Monrovia. And the second one was when I went with Joseph Brown.

  • Thank you. You have mentioned Joseph Brown. He went with you on the second trip, correct?

  • And you explained why you didn't go back to Sierra Leone. Joseph Brown, what did he do?

  • Joseph Brown is - of course is a Liberian. He hid himself from me and came back to Foday Sankoh and told Foday Sankoh that we have come but we didn't get anything and he has told me to come and I have refused to come.

  • So Joseph Brown went to --

  • Foday Sankoh, my Lord.

  • Excuse me, I'm talking now about Joseph Brown. Joseph Brown was in the Ivory Coast with Foday Sankoh as part of Foday Sankoh's delegation, correct?

  • And he was sent by Foday Sankoh to Liberia with you to purchase ammunition in Monrovia, correct?

  • And then he went back in the same - was it the same 1996 that he went back to Sierra Leone?

  • Yes, my Lord, he went back.

  • When you went back to Sierra Leone after being invited by Foday Sankoh to rejoin the RUF, you said you went back in late 1999, did you see Joseph Brown back with the RUF in Sierra Leone?

  • Joseph Brown never returned.

  • Did you see Joseph Brown in Sierra Leone since you came back to Sierra Leone?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • What year did you see him?

  • This was in 2000 I met him in Kono.

  • He was working with Issa Sesay, correct?

  • So, sir, when did you first meet Musa Cisse? I am not sure if you have answered that question.

  • I said I met us Musa Cisse on - at the time when I was going to Monrovia. That was the time I came across him. At that time my family was already with me, so I have to sleep.

  • Now earlier you talked about the external delegation staying at Musa Cisse's house?

  • Did you go and see them at Musa Cisse's house?

  • At that time they have already departed for Abidjan, my Lord.

  • So tell us about meeting Musa Cisse at the time - let me start the question over. You said, "I said I met Musa Cisse at the time when I was going to Monrovia." So you are referring to the time you got the mission from Foday Sankoh to purchase ammunition, correct, or materials?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • So tell us, how did you meet Musa Cisse at that time?

  • When my wife was asked to move to Abidjan - because she was not part and parcel of the delegation, she was just brought there and left there. She was brought there by Philip Palmer. So all of them were staying there. So when I came, before I could go in to Liberia, I have to go to my family and I met them there and Musa Cisse was there. And I greeted him and I told - I mean I just thanked him for keeping my family. And I told him that after I returned I would take my family. But I don't know when I will come, so I would like them to stay until I shall return from Liberia.

  • So was it in Abidjan that you met Musa Cisse?

  • Not in Abidjan, my Lord.

  • Danane, my Lord.

  • Was it at his house?

  • The RUF had used the radio at Musa Cisse's house for communications, correct?

  • Thank you. Now, sir, when you got this mission to go purchase arms and ammunition, you were sitting - Foday Sankoh was sitting in a room in his hotel, correct? That's where you met him?

  • When he gave me the mission, my Lord?

  • Now, I have stated it, he told me about the mission, but prior to starting or going on my mission he misbehaved to the - to the international community. That made Issa Sesay - Amara Essy to get annoyed and immediately that night he decided, Foday Sankoh, to move from the house - from the hotel and he went to a lodge. In that lodge the next day they gave me, my Lord.

  • Thank you for clarifying that. So when you got the mission from Foday Sankoh, was it in the hotel or in the lodge?

  • It was in the lodge, sir.

  • And it was in a bedroom was he speaking to you?

  • No, he spoke to me right in the sitting room, sir.

  • And there were only three of you present at that time, is that correct?

  • We were not only three, my Lord.

  • Philip Palmer was there. Saye Boayou was there. Deen-Jalloh was there. Dr Barrie was also there. A lady called Jane Maturi [phon] was there. And a lady called Matilda, I don't know the surname now, she was there. And Memunatu Mansaray. They were all present, sir.

  • So Deen-Jalloh and Philip Palmer were aware of your mission to go to Monrovia to purchase ammunition, correct?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • They were there when Foday Sankoh gave you the instruction for this mission, correct?

  • Now, also present was Saye Boayou, correct?

  • And he was an NPFL Special Forces, correct?

  • His name has been mentioned here before, so I would like to briefly remind - put to you the testimony and see if you know anything about it. If we could have the transcript for 25 March 2010, page 37983, the last ten lines. It must be the next page. From page 37984, the witness says:

    "In 1990 after Bong Mines had been captured by the NPFL, later one of the Special Forces called Isaac Boayou was deployed there as a commander. Not Isaac - Saye Boayou. He was deployed there as the commander for the NPFL in Bong Mines.

    And then if we could have the transcript for 19 May 2010, page 41167. The first testimony I read was an open from an open witness John Vincent. Now I am reading from the testimony of Joseph Dehmie. Beginning at line 9:

    "Q. March, April 1990 you're in Bong Mines. You go there

    with James Galakpai. Who, if anyone, is in command of Bong

    Mines for the NPFL?"

    The transcript reads, Madam President:

    "A. C boy was the commander. He was in charge."

    And then Mr Anyah says:

    "Madam President, I believe that name is on the record previously, Saye Boayou. I can have the witness spell it, but I am fairly certain it's on the record:

    Q. Mr Dehmie, can you spell Saye Boayou?"

    And the witness does that. And then he is thanked and he is asked:

    "Q. Saye Boayou, did he have any person underneath him as

    his deputy?

    A. Really I can't tell you because I didn't know. We have

    gone there for the entire day and come back."

  • Not for the entire day. For a day.

  • Thank you. Madam President, I would also make an application now to have the transcript checked because it's quite obvious to me from the context of this transcript that the phonetic answer C boy was not what the witness said. Mr Anyah clearly heard Saye Boayou. I would ask that that be checked.

  • Does the transcript say C boy was the phonetic spelling?

  • One moment, please. It doesn't say that, your Honour. I can move on:

  • Sir, you confirmed what John Vincent said, Saye Boayou was an NPFL Special Forces, correct?

  • Now, sir, Foday Sankoh told you that this purchase of ammunition from an ECOMOG commander in Monrovia, that Saye Boayou would make all the arrangements, correct?

  • He had all the contacts, correct?

  • Sir, Charles Taylor testified in this Court that he, through his subordinates, had purchased arms and ammunition, or at least ammunition, on many occasions from ECOMOG officers. Did Saye Boayou tell you that he had experience working for the NPFL in purchasing arms and ammunition from ECOMOG?

  • No, my Lord.

  • It was clear to you that Foday Sankoh had confidence that Saye Boayou had the connections to make this purchase from ECOMOG, correct?

  • And Saye Boayou was an NPFL officer, correct?

  • Now, in 1996 when you travelled from Ivory Coast to Monrovia, how did you get there, the first time?

  • I travelled through Danane, went to Gbutuo, crossing to Liberian side. Went to Ganta. From Ganta, there are certain - there are some villages I crossed, which I don't know their names. From Ganta, I came to Gbarnga. From Gbarnga I came to Phebe, from Phebe to Suakoko, Suakoko to Gbatala, Gbatala to Wainsue, Wainsue from Salala, Salala I came straight to Kakata, Kakata to Monrovia.

  • Sir, were you travelling in a vehicle?

  • And whose vehicle was it?

  • It was a trafficking vehicle, that is, passengers vehicle, my Lord.

  • Well, were you taking public transportation or was it Saye Boayou's vehicle? How were you getting there?

  • We were taking public transports, my Lord.

  • Mr Koumjian, this is an appropriate time to break. We will take half an hour's break and reconvene at 12 noon.

  • [Break taken at 11.30 a.m.]

  • [Upon resuming at 12.07 p.m.]

  • Can I announce a change of appearance on the Defence Bench. We are now joined by Ms Logan Hambrick.

  • It's noted. Mr Koumjian, please continue.

  • Sir, I would like to read to you from some of the testimony from Charles Taylor, transcript from 3 August 2009, page 25785. This is in relation to your mission to go purchase arms and ammunition from ECOMOG in Monrovia in 1996. I want to put to you some of Charles Taylor's testimony. So on page 25785, line 4, Mr Taylor was asked:

    "Q. How do you know that ECOMOG did that?

    A. Well, we knew ECOMOG very well. We knew. We bought

    weapons from ECOMOG while we were fighting."

    Then if we could have the transcript for 26 November 2009, page 32628. Beginning to read from line 17, Mr Taylor said:

    "Mr Koumjian, I only want to deal with the statement I made

    before this Court. I have not bribed any ECOMOG officer.

    I bought ammunition from them."

    Then he was asked a question about that and he answered:

    "Well maybe they did not consider selling arms and

    ammunition illegally based on their own chain of command,

    because if you're an officer in the field and you sell

    ammunition, that must be accounted for and some superior

    doesn't ask you. Maybe it was a programme.

    Q. In fact, Mr Taylor, you told us that you bought

    ammunition from one unit to use and fight against and

    presumably try and kill other units from ECOMOG, correct?

    A. Well, I said I bought ammunition from them, yes, and

    that ammunition was used to fight ECOMOG."

    Sir, the man that was sent - your contact sent to arrange the purchase of arms and ammunition from ECOMOG, Saye Boayou, did he tell you he had previous experience working with the NPFL in purchasing arms and ammunition from ECOMOG?

  • No, your Honour.

  • It was clear to you that Saye Boayou knew this ECOMOG officer, correct?

  • Yes, your Honour.

  • And, sir, what was your plan as far as how you would take the arms and ammunition back to Sierra Leone - or to Sierra Leone?

  • Your Honour, I was supposed to receive this arms and ammunition - ammunitions from this ECOMOG, then I was going to be escorted by Saye Boayou to the - I mean, the border of - between Liberia and Guinea and Sierra Leone. Then I will have passed that through that particular post to get in, but I was supposed to hand it over to the commander at that time, Mike Lamin.

  • Sir, what was the purpose of Saye Boayou escorting you to the border of Sierra Leone?

  • We need to know that arms and ammunitions are very vital and he was given that order by Foday Sankoh.

  • In fact, sir, this 1996 November was a time of disarmament in Liberia, correct?

  • Yes, your Honour.

  • There was a ceasefire and the NPFL and Charles Taylor were preparing for elections the next year, correct?

  • Yes, your Honour.

  • Did you see any ECOMOG checkpoints in your travels to Liberia on those two occasions in 1996? ECOMOG checkpoints, did you pass through any of those?

  • At that time, no, your Honour. All checkpoints were under the supervisions of the NPFL, sir.

  • And you realised that if you were travelling with an ECOMOG officer, Saye Boayou, you wouldn't have a problem going through NPFL checkpoints - excuse me. If you were travelling with Saye Boayou, an NPFL commander, you would have no trouble travelling through NPFL checkpoints, correct?

  • Yes, your Honour.

  • And also if you had travelled with an ECOMOG officer, he also could help you get through any ECOMOG checkpoint, correct?

  • Yes, your Honour.

  • Now, sir, at the time that you went with one of Charles Taylor's commanders, Saye Boayou, to purchase ammunition for the RUF, you were actually on that mission the day that the Lome Peace Accord - excuse me, the Abidjan Peace Accord, 30 November 1996, was signed. You were on your mission to purchase arms and ammunition, correct?

  • So it was clear that this mission with the NPFL commander to purchase arms and ammunition - it was clear from this mission that Foday Sankoh sent you on, that Foday Sankoh did not intend to comply with the Abidjan Peace Accord, would you agree?

  • I will, your Honour.

  • Because the Abidjan Peace Accord called for the RUF to disarm in paragraph - in Article 6 it called for disarmament of the RUF, correct?

  • Yes, your Honour.

  • Sir, I just want to go back to the meeting that you had with Charles Taylor and remind you quickly of a bit of your testimony about that. So if we could have the transcript from 1 June, page 41796 on the screen, please. At line 20 I asked you about that meeting:

    "Q. What did Charles Taylor say to them?

    A. He said, 'You people should stop. I've heard from

    Bockarie that there is an infighting. That is, there is a

    problem between Issa Sesay and Sam Bockarie, and therefore

    I want you to be dissolved and you should take Sam Bockarie

    back to Sierra Leone.'"

    Then going to page 41797, the next page. At line 25 you were asked:

    "Q. When Charles Taylor then encouraged Issa Sesay and

    RUF to accept Sam Bockarie back within the movement,


    A. Yes."

    And that's correct, is it?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • Sam Bockarie asked the RUF to take - Charles Taylor asked the RUF to take Sam Bockarie back to Sierra Leone within the RUF, correct?

  • Now I would like to read you some testimony from 19 August 2009, page 27192. Sir, this again is testimony from Charles Taylor. When I start to read, what I'll be reading is the Defence counsel in his question is first reading the testimony of a Prosecution witness and that was TF1-388.

    Your Honour, I did refer to the Abidjan Accord and Article 6. That is an exhibit just for everyone's - for their information. It's D-87. Article 6 is the provision that calls for the RUF to disarm.

    Sir, the Defence counsel in August of last year, reading from the testimony of Prosecution witness TF1-388, read:

    "That the witness goes on. First he - that is you, Mr Taylor - suggested that he would want to take Mosquito back, and Issa said no. And he said, 'Ah but, Issa, if you would take care as a commander, as a leader.' Then Issa said except if he returned and informed the RUF family he said because RUF was a family."

    Then Mr Taylor was asked by his counsel:

    "Q. Now, did you suggest that Mosquito be taken back?

    A. No, I did not suggest that."

    Mr Witness, Charles Taylor lied to these judges when he said that because you were present when he asked Issa Sesay to take Sam Bockarie back to Sierra Leone, correct?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • Thank you. No further questions, your Honour.

  • Mr Munyard, any re-examination?

  • Yes, Madam President, I have some questions.

  • Mr Witness, when you were first giving evidence in fact on 1 June - sorry, when you were first being cross-examined, I should have said, on 1 June - I'm not going to ask for the transcript to be brought up, but for anyone who wants to follow this point it's the transcript for 1 June at page 41784, lines 9 to 13. You said to my learned friend Mr Koumjian who was asking you questions from the other side of the Court that when you were working in Monrovia you used to pass through Mr Taylor's house in Congo Town and you later said passed by his house. When you said passed through his house, do you mean you actually entered his house, or what did you mean by that?

  • I meant passing - we should use the right word. I passed in front of his house.

  • Very well. Now, you were shown a document. I don't want it put on the screen. It is MFI-5 and it's tab 1 in the Prosecution's bundle. You were asked about questions from a transcript from another case. It was put to you that a witness in another case said this: That you, you yourself, Mr Witness, said that it was President Taylor who called you in the mansion. Have you ever lived in a mansion?

  • Later on you were asked questions about your role in the external delegation and you said you spoke to the international world twice. Can you remember who you spoke to?

  • I spoke directly to a BBC correspondent. I first called - we had a number for BBC so Issa Sesay directed me to tell the world that while they disarmament or other negotiations are going on enemies are attacking our positions.

  • Do you know who it was you spoke to from the BBC?

  • No, I was just told to sit down by the phone and I spoke directly to the correspondent but I don't know the name of that correspondent.

  • Did you yourself make the call or did the BBC correspondent call you?

  • I first made the call. Then they asked me to wait. Then I waited for at least five minutes and I was called back.

  • The satellite phone you were using, do you know who was paying the bill for that satellite phone?

  • I'm now going to deal with a different matter. Actually, it relates to the first area that I asked you about. You talked at a later stage in your cross-examination about Mr Taylor coming out on to a corridor, I think to greet people. What do you mean by he came out on to the corridor?

  • After Charles Taylor was confirmly elected the President of Liberia he decided to celebrate his 49th birthday. On that day he didn't come closer to civilians or other people - I mean citizens. But he came to the corridor that is the open part of his house and stood there, spoke to the people, I mean, about the birthday and he said everybody was invited to celebrate it in a peaceful manner. Then he went right back in his - inside.

  • When you say the corridor is the open part of his house, can you just describe what you mean by that open part of his house?

  • Here comes the building. There's a porch outside where we can call it - it's an open place. It's a way that you can pass to go in. That can we call it a veranda? Yes.

  • Is this something that is open to the public or do you have to go in through the gate of the compound to be there?

  • At the time he was speaking only his bodyguards were inside. The citizens were out of the compound. We stood behind the road and he was in his house. His bodyguards were outside. Then we stood on the main road.

  • Were you able to see him in this open part of his house from standing on the main road?

  • Yes, my Lord.

  • Thank you. I'm going to ask two matters, Madam President, that were dealt with in private session. Can we go briefly, therefore, back into private session?

  • Certainly. We are going to go into a brief private session to deal with evidence that should protect the identity of the witness.

  • [At this point in the proceedings, a portion of the transcript, pages 42057 to 42058, was extracted and sealed under separate cover, as the proceeding was heard in private session.]

  • [Open session]

  • Your Honour, we're in open session.

  • Madam President, I have no other questions. Are there any questions from the Bench?

  • There are no questions from the Bench, but we'll deal with the exhibits now.

  • Your Honour, our records show six MFIs and the Prosecution would move those into evidence. MFI-2, 3 and 4 we believe should be confidential.

  • Yes, thank you, and 5.

  • Does the Defence object to these exhibits?

  • No, thank you. We agree that the relevant ones should be confidential.

  • Then the exhibits will be admitted as follows:

    MFI-1, which is a map of Liberia as marked by the witness, will be exhibit P-536.

    MFI-2, which was previously described on the record, is admitted as exhibit P-537 and will be marked confidential.

    MFI-3, which is a letter described earlier in the record, is admitted as exhibit P-538 and will be marked confidential.

    MFI-4 is a web page, a CNN web page described earlier in the record, and that will be admitted as exhibit P-539 and will be marked confidential.

    MFI-5 is a transcript described earlier in the record. That will be admitted as exhibit P-540 and will be marked confidential.

    MFI-6A is the Sierra Leone Truth and Reconciliation Commission Report, volume 3B, chapter 2, consisting of two pages, that is, page 61 and the relevant cover page. That is admitted as exhibit P-541A.

    And MFI-6B is a copy of the same report, volume 3B, chapter 4, page 304, and the relevant cover page, it's two pages. That will be admitted as exhibit P-541B.

  • [Exhibits P-536 to P-541B admitted]

  • Mr Witness, we've come to the end of your testimony and we would like to thank you for your time and your testimony and we wish you a safe journey home.

  • Thank you, madam.

  • Mr Munyard, your next witness, please.

  • Madam President, your Honours, I'm taking the next witness. But before she is called in, can I just bring one matter to everybody's attention. We were expecting to have a third - in fact, a fourth witness here in The Hague this week who was expected to fly on Sunday and literally at the last minute, for personal reasons, he decided he could not fly.

    We did indicate in our filing on Monday of this week, 31 May, that for logistical reasons we wouldn't be able to call that witness, that's DCT-103, who we were anticipating calling after the witness who is about to give evidence. But the reason I'm telling you this is that the witness who is about to come in, DCT-224, is likely in our estimation to be a short witness and I thought it only right and proper to tell the Court that we may well finish that witness's testimony before the lunch adjournment tomorrow. So I wanted people to know in advance that we may well find that we have - that we've run short this week.

    I can tell you that every effort was put in, in particular by the Witness and Victim Section, to try to get witnesses here this week as expected and, in fact, I would say they went above and beyond the call of duty in their efforts to ensure that we would get enough people here this week. And we certainly were engaged, particularly over the course of last weekend, to try to ensure that, but it may well be that we find that we run out of witnesses at some time between now and tomorrow at 1.30 p.m.

  • So noted.

  • Can I just ask for one clarification, and that would be: Who would be the witness after this witness who is upcoming who is about to start to testify? It's not clear to us who the next witness will be.

  • Certainly. That will be witness DCT-190. But that witness is not yet here and is arriving at the weekend as planned. So the flow will continue. The one who - DCT-103, who wasn't able to travel last weekend, we do plan to call, but we can't call in the order that we had originally indicated to everybody.

  • Mr Munyard, could you address us as to the language that this witness is going to use, their religion, et cetera, and protective measures, if applicable.

  • Yes. DCT-224 will testify in Liberian English with the assistance of an interpreter. She will swear on the Bible and she will testify openly. In the light of that, she, of course, is covered by your Honours' order of 27 May 2009, which protected her identity, along with that of all the other Defence witnesses. We are asking your Honours to revoke such parts of that order as protect her identity. She is willing to testify fully openly.

  • Right. The protective measures in place for witness DCT-224 as ordered by this Court are hereby rescinded on the application of the Defence. And the witness should be called in, please.

    Mr Bangura?

  • May it please the Court, Madam President, your Honours, I have conduct of the cross-examination of this witness, thank you.

  • Thank you. That is so noted.