The transcripts of the trial of Charles Taylor, former President of Liberia. More…

  • Please proceed.

  • I did not get the interpretation. I heard the witness. Is the interpretation in place?

  • Mr Interpreter, has the - we did not hear the interpretation of the witness's swearing of the oath. Was that interpreted?

  • Your Honours, the witness almost started swearing in English.

  • You have heard, Mr Koumjian, the reply.

  • I am satisfied that the witness did give the oath in English as long as all other parties are, thank you.

  • Sir, Mr Witness, can you tell the Court what your name is?

  • Yes, my name is Joseph D Marzah, commonly known as Zigzag Marzah.

  • Sir, can you please spell Marzah for the Court?

  • Yes, capital M-a-r-z-a-h.

  • Thank you. Can you tell us when you were born?

  • Yes, I was born since 1958, 7th June.

  • Thank you. Where were you born?

  • Is that Nimba County, Liberia?

  • What languages do you speak?

  • And do you speak English, or Liberian English?

  • I speak Liberian English.

  • Thank you. What tribe do you consider yourself a member of?

  • Thank you. Sir, have you ever performed any military service?

  • Can you tell us how your military service began?

  • Yes, I joined the army in 1978.

  • Thank you. Which army was that that you joined in 1978?

  • Infantry at Camp Schefflein.

  • Okay, because was that at that time the Armed Forces of Liberia? The AFL?

  • How long were you in the AFL?

  • Since 1978 up to 1985. I left the AFL in '85 and went to exile and that was during the Doe regime. At the time he was carrying out atrocities against the people from Nimba, so some of us were targeted by him so I decided to run to go to Ivory Coast.

  • Thank you. When you were in the Ivory Coast, did you join any other military organisation?

  • No, I was in a displaced camp in Ivory Coast in zone - around the Zongway [phon] villages.

  • Okay. And how long did you stay in the Ivory Coast?

  • From '85 I was there up to - let us say I spent few times there, I cannot recall that time, until I returned back to Liberia during the civil crisis.

  • Okay, thank you. Now when you returned back to Liberia, were you alone, or with a group?

  • Yes, I came back along with Prince Johnson's group, who were about 17, and I was recruited by him in Ivory Coast. He told me that we had a leader by the name of Charles Taylor who was there to redeem us, the people from Nimba, so we should be prepared to join him for us to come and redeem our country on December, 24th 1989.

  • Thank you, sir, for that explanation. Now, while you were in the Ivory Coast you said you met Prince Johnson. Had you met him before?

  • Yes, I met Prince Johnson at Camp Schefflein before from the time he was first lieutenant. And then at that time, when Doe was carrying on atrocities against the people from Nimba County when I left, the second time I met him was in Ivory Coast when he brought the message to us that there was a leader who was there to support us.

  • Thank you. You have told us that he introduced - that he told you the name of the leader was Charles Taylor. Did you meet Charles Taylor?

  • Just one moment. Did you meet Charles Taylor while you were in the Ivory Coast?

  • No. He told me that Charles Taylor was in Burkina Faso and he had the full support for us, so if there was anything that we required to enter he will come after we enter and when we captured a ground he will come and meet us there. We entered on 24 December and at that time we were at [indiscernible] enter place and each time Prince Johnson used to send --

  • Your Honours, the witness is running too fast.

  • Please pause, Mr Witness. You are going too fast for the interpreter. Please slow down a little so he can interpret what you are saying.

  • Your Honour, I hesitate to interrupt, but I think we failed to get on the record a place name given by this witness.

  • Mr Witness, please repeat your answer starting from "We entered on 24 December and at that time we were at ..." Tell us - continue from there and name the place.

  • Thank you. From Ivory Coast we entered in Botou on 24 December 1989. From Botou, at that time I had not yet seen Charles Taylor. Prince Johnson was the commander, but he, Prince Johnson, he told us that there was one William Obie who was going to be the battle group commander to lead us, but later he was afraid and some of the Special Forces of Charles Taylor were arrested in Ivory Coast. So Prince Johnson and us passed through Botou as far as Blantou, so we came as far as Tiaplay and that was where we were based and --

  • Your Honours, the witness is still running too fast.

  • Please go a bit slower, Mr Witness, please. The interpreter is not keeping up with you.

    Mr Interpreter, we have got most of it down.

  • Mr Witness, if you could pause after every few sentences it will allow the interpreter --

  • Your Honours, there was a town that he called after the town Botou, after the other town Botou. I did not get that one clear.

  • Mr Witness, the interpreter requires you to repeat the name of a town that you mentioned after you talked of "Prince Johnson and us passed through Botou". What was that town?

  • From Botou there were some small, small villages on the way, but from Botou we based in Blantou where Nathaniel Karper [phone] who was paid by our leader through Prince Johnson. He paid him to undertake protection for us and that was where we were based for the first/second times in Blantou. The third base for us was in Tiaplay where we were and we were practising in Kamplay against the AFL.

  • Okay, thank you. Your Honours, a couple of spellings. Botou B-O-T-O-U and Blantou B-L-A-N-T-O-U. I think the witness said Kamplay was the final base:

  • Is that right, Mr Witness? Where was --

  • No, the next place was Tiaplay. Tiaplay. We were based in Tiaplay whilst we were practising against the AFL in Kamplay.

  • Thank you. Tiaplay T-I-A-P-L-A-Y and Kamplay - and the witness can correct me if I am wrong --

  • No, no, we did not base in Kamplay. We did not base in Kamplay.

  • Okay, I missed the next place. Mr Witness, after Tiaplay where did you say you went?

  • After Tiaplay that was where we were and a conflict erupted between - amongst the Special Forces, between the Special Forces and Prince Johnson who was our commander, and at each time we captured an area Prince Johnson will send a letter to our leader, Mr Taylor, and the Special Forces will take the letters from the envelope and then they will send a counter letter against Prince Johnson. From there Prince Johnson deployed us to go as far as Tapeta and on our way moving they, the Special Forces, against him they had a conflict, so he went away and from there some of the Special Forces came and arrested me. They took me to Gborplay.

  • Witness, thank you. Just the way we have to do it is I have to ask you the questions and please give me a chance to ask you another question after you give a short answer to what I have asked. You indicated --

  • Mr Koumjian, there was a name of a person - a person, William somebody - that was not spelt.

  • Excuse me. I believe was that William Gboley?

  • The problem is when we compound spellings we get totally lost. William somebody.

  • I said William Obie, who was selected by Mr Taylor to be the first battle group to enter with us in Liberia. He was a coward, so Prince Johnson took that initiative and we were able to join him to enter through Botou.

  • Thank you. Okay, a couple of spellings. Obie O-B-I-E and Gborplay G-B-O-R-P-L-A-Y:

  • Mr Witness, you have indicated that on 24 December 1989 you entered Liberia with 17 - in a group of 17. Was Charles Taylor with you at that time?

  • No, no. The group was - they were 17. They were 16 in number, so when I added to them we went to 17.

  • So, we were 17 in number that we entered very early in the morning between 3 and 4.

  • Thank you. So can you tell us after you entered Liberia what was the first time, if ever, that you saw Charles Taylor?

  • My very first time to meet our leader, Mr Taylor, was in Gborplay at that time. The remaining Special Forces were there and the remaining Special Forces arrested me and took me to Gborplay. I was not alone. Myself and Prince Johnson they took us there and they kept us in an old car box that appeared like a container, and they were lighting fire - lighting fire on top of the container and whilst it was burning we were shaking inside the container and at that time some of our friends had already died.

    So, he asked them and they opened the container. They took us out. I think at that time we were about 26 or 25, something like that, but six of us were still alive and they took us in a wheelbarrow. Then they took us to a place, Hacia [phon] in Gborplay, and we slept there outside until the next morning I was able to see him.

  • Okay. Mr Witness, we are going to go a little bit more slowly through that. Now, you have told us that you were arrested by Special Forces. First, can you tell the Court what you mean by Special Forces?

  • The Special Forces means those who were trained from Libya, Burkina Faso, by Charles Taylor.

  • Thank you. Now the organisation that you joined and you said you then entered Liberia with with Prince Johnson, did that have a name? What was the name of the organisation?

  • At first we never had a name. We called ourselves freedom fighters.

  • Did you later get a name?

  • Yes, after the arrival of Mr Taylor in Gborplay that we had the name the NPFL, the National Patriotic Front of Liberia.

  • Thank you. Now, you have told us that you and others were placed in a container. Who were the other people that were placed in the container with you by the Special Forces?

  • Like Maduna Bwua. You know, I have not been expecting to sit like this today to narrate a long story like this, but it was not something to be kept in mind.

  • Yes, and thank you. I don't need the names, but Maduna is M-A-D-U-N-A?

  • Can you spell the last name?

  • Mr Witness, the other people that were arrested with you, what group did they belong to?

  • From the same junior commando group that was fighting under Prince Johnson through the directive of Mr Taylor.

  • Now, you say in the container some of your fellow soldiers died. Can you just explain why they died?

  • Because of the heat and moreover the kind of way the fire was on top of the container and it took place during the dry season.

  • Thank you. You indicated, I believe, that about six of you survived. How many were in the container? How many died, do you know?

  • We were above 20 plus. We were above 20, 25 or 26, something like that, but I can't recall now. It is a long story, but I am saying the truth and nothing but the truth.

  • Thank you. Now, how was it that you were let out of the container? Can you explain that?

  • Yes, it was through his excellency, Mr Taylor, as the NP commander, Cooper Weah[sic] he asked - he said, "What is in this container that you are setting fire over it?", and then later they explained to him that, "These are the Prince Johnson boys", and from there he said, "No, this is not the reason why you people are here for. You are here to help. The problem between Prince Johnson and myself is not the thing", and at that time we were helpless and because of the heat most of our brothers had already died.

  • So when Charles Taylor ordered you out of the container, how did you feel towards Charles Taylor?

  • Before God and man he was looking so great to me, and I was grateful to him to do any kind of piece of job that he would want me to do.

  • Did you express your gratitude towards - to Charles Taylor?

  • Yes, I let him feel at all time that he saved my life and a way that I would have proved that to him was to fight a physical battle against any enemy that was fighting against him.

  • Thank you. There was one spelling I am not sure we have had before, a name Cooper Teah. Cooper C-O-O-P-E-R and Teah T-E-A-H.

  • Thank you, Mr Witness. Let me ask the next question. Sir, you indicated that in the container many of your fellow soldiers died. Was anyone punished for killing your fellow soldiers by setting the fires on the container?

  • No, no, I never experienced anything like that. The only thing that Mr Taylor did in our presence was the time he was re-ordering us and he said, "Next time you should treat those boys nicely, the ones who have come to embrace you to fight the battle against Doe", but after that he did not give any punishment against any other person.

  • So, sir, after that incident where you pledged loyalty to Charles Taylor, what assignments did you get? What did you do?

  • After my release from the container by Charles Taylor, he assigned me within the 1st Battalion under Edward Millen [phon].

  • Did you see any action when you were with the 1st Battalion? Any fighting?

  • Yes, we fought. We went as far as myself and our friend, commonly known as Godfather, along with --

  • Your Honours, your Honours, could the witness reduce his pace a little?

  • Again, Mr Witness, we ask that you speak a little slower so the interpreter can keep up. Please continue with your answer. You had said you were with a friend who you named and said was also called Godfather. Please give the name again.

  • Perhaps I could spell the name before the witness continues. He said Edward Mieh [sic], M-I-E-H.

  • I will repeat. I said after we were released I was ordered by Charles Taylor along with a Special Force member by the name of Godfather. His full name is Alfred Mieh. We took the route and went to battle at Tapeta along with some Special Forces under Edward Millen, who was the battalion commander.

  • Is this a different Edward? Edward Millen?

  • I think that is the name. Edward Mieh [sic] was the battalion commander, but the witness indicated a Special Forces member Alfred and I am sorry I didn't get the last name that he was with.

  • Edward Millen was a Special Forces member who was the battalion commander. Alfred Mieh, commonly known as Godfather, was a Special Forces. John Gubay [phon] was a Special Forces, Suleman Sewar [phon] was a Special Forces, Paul Weah [phon], who was the battalion SO, was the Special Forces, but I was the most senior junior commando amongst them.

  • Okay, thank you. Just to clarify one thing, Mr Witness. When you mentioned Edward Mieh [sic] and Alfred Mieh, is that the same last name, or is it a different last name?

  • No, Edward Millen is different. Alfred Mieh is different. Millen is different. Mieh is different. It was Mieh that was called Godfather. Edward Millen is different. The difference is - there is a big demarcation. Edward Millen is from Berika [phon]. Alfred Mieh is from [indiscernible] District.

  • Thank you. We will attempt to get spellings.

  • I think we have a problem here of spellings. We are totally lost. We can't even keep up with the record.

  • Okay, sir, we will continue. When you say a name if you could just pause so we can check whether we need to spell it, that would be helpful to us.

  • Okay.

  • Wait for the questions. So, where did you see fighting? Where did you fight with the NPFL after being released from the container?

  • When I was removed from the container, the first place I started fighting was Grey, Lower Nimba.

  • Okay, thank you. Did you see fighting in other areas also later?

  • Yes, after Grey I went as far as - and we captured Tapeta. That is the Lower Nimba capital city.

  • Okay. Sir, can you just tell us now how long were you with the NPFL? From the time that you said you joined Prince Johnson before it had that name in 1989 when you entered Liberia, until when were you a member of the NPFL, or its successor organisations?

  • I will say the truth and nothing but the truth. I have been with the NPFL from the start to the end up to 2003.

  • Have you seen many battles with the NPFL and its successor organisations?

  • Come again, please.

  • During those years that you were with the NPFL and its successor organisations, did you see much fighting, or did you participate in much fighting?

  • Yes, I fought in so many areas. I don't think there was any county in Liberia where I did not battle.

  • Mr Witness, you have told us that you fought before being placed in the container with Prince Johnson forces and you told us you remained with the NPFL and it successors up to 2003. Can you compare how the Prince Johnson forces treated civilians with how the NPFL forces treated civilians?

  • Yes, I will say the truth and nothing but the truth. Even though Prince Johnson is not here, but during his administration the hard --

  • Your Honours, your Honours, the witness said a word that was not clear to me. Is it hardship, or - was it hardship?

  • Mr Witness, you said "during the administration" and what was the next word you used?

  • I said during Prince Johnson's administration there was no authority to go and harass civilians, or even to rape, or to loot, during Prince Johnson's administration. When you joined Prince Johnson, the cloth that you had on you you would battle with it until you return. At any time he saw something strange with you, you would either be executed, or you will go through military discipline, so there was no way you could play around civilians during Prince Johnson's administration. What he told us was to battle against soldiers and to ensure that we overthrow Doe from the directive from Charles Taylor to him.

  • And how did that compare with your time with the NPFL? How were civilians treated with the NPFL?

  • I will say the truth and nothing but the truth. When our leader himself was present in Liberia, there were more opportunities for us. We had a chance to do anything, like to loot, to rape. At the same time what you got was for you to be courageous and battle for him.

  • When you are talking about battling for "him", who are you talking about?

  • Charles Taylor.

  • And in your answer when you said, "When our leader himself was present in Liberia", who were you referring to when you said "our leader himself"?

  • I am talking about Mr Taylor.

  • Thank you. Now, Mr Witness, before the election of Charles Taylor as President, were the NPFL soldiers paid any salary?

  • Before election, or after elections?

  • Before the election.

  • No, we had go ahead that what - wheresoever we captured, what we got there was for us. So, we were encouraged to battle. We were not physically paid, no.

  • Sir, when you were with the NPFL, were there any tactics that were used to create fear in your opponents and those around you, those civilians around the area?

  • Yes. When I was with NPFL to fight from Tapeta to go to Grand Bassa, the tactics that we used sometimes we set ambushes, but before setting any ambush anywhere, anywhere we are going to capture, the battle that we do there there is no rescue for any civilian. From there you take the human head and you would place it over your car bumper and when people see it they become afraid and when the enemy hears that news they will say the people who are coming, the men who are coming, do not forgive any person. So, for that reason they too would vanish.

  • Was there any practice that you used at check points with the NPFL to create fear?

  • Yes, after we left Nimba to go as far as Kamutes Town [phon], as far as Monrovia, any check point we use human intestine, sometimes we put the head on a stick for people to be afraid.

  • How would you use the human intestines at the check point?

  • When the person is executed, when he is executed his stomach is slit and you take the intestine and you use it as a rope and you take the head and place it on a stick and you put it aside the check point.

  • And what is the intestine used for? Just to wrap around the head, or did you --

  • I told you we would take the intestine. It doesn't have the guts, but it is long like from here to the end of that office there [indicated]. You hold it and draw it and tie it to the other side, across the road and tie it where the MPs would be sitting down. You tie it there and you take the head and place it over the stick facing the area where you were going for battle.

  • You pointed to something. Are you pointing to the corner of this room when you said the distance?

  • From this desk - okay, from this desk as far as to where I am sitting here [indicated]. Sometimes you would use intestines of two human beings. You remove the shit from it and you tie it, you knot it and you tie it across the road.

  • The witness pointed to a desk that appears to me to be about 10 or 12 - 10 metres from the witness.

  • Yes, is that estimate agreed by Defence counsel?

  • I am unaware as to which particular desk.

  • For the purposes of record, the witness appeared to me to be pointing to the desk where the legal officers are sitting and estimating from there to where he is sitting.

  • This one?

  • [Microphone not activated].

  • Mr Witness, do you know if Charles Taylor ever passed these check points that had the displays that you are talking about of human heads and intestines?

  • Yes, he was aware. He made us understand that as guerillas you have to play with human blood so that the enemy forces would be afraid of you. He checked at some of the check points in so many areas.

  • Were you present with Charles Taylor at some of these check points when he was there?

  • I told you that I was one of the most senior junior commandos and each time we battle, when he comes to come and visit us we had to go and welcome him and take him to our CP and he will see our various check points like Buchanan highway. When we were moving there he saw more than eight check points decorated with human intestines and human heads. There is he, you can ask him.

  • Thank you. Mr Witness, do you know a person by the name of Foday Sankoh?

  • Tell us where you first met, or got to know of Foday Sankoh?

  • Yes. I saw Foday Sankoh after Charles Taylor released us from the container. I think about two to three days, let us say about five days before he gave us instructions to go and battle he introduced Foday Sankoh to us as his colleague Foday Sankoh and some Gambian forces like Domingo, Dr Manneh. There were so many I can't recall them all, yes.

  • What did Charles Taylor say to you when he introduced Foday Sankoh?

  • He said he was one of the senior men assigned with him. All of them were there to help us to go and overthrow Doe at the time in Gborplay.

  • Now, Mr Witness, did you ever receive any assignment from Charles Taylor related to Foday Sankoh?

  • Yes, at that time we had battled from Nimba County, Grand Bassa, and we were at Margibi, when the Sierra Leone forces used to join the AFL to fight against us, when the heard that Foday Sankoh was about to go to Sierra Leone to become a leader, so the forces that --

  • Your Honours, can the witness kindly repeat the last bit.

  • Mr Witness, again the interpreter finds you a bit fast. Would you please repeat your answer from the point where you say, "Foday Sankoh was about to go to Sierra Leone to become a leader". Continue from there, please.

  • Thank you. I said Foday Sankoh, at the time he had the forces from Monrovia in Schefflein. They were mixed with Sierra Leonean soldiers. So, they had the forum by the Special Forces, including my own immediate commander, the late Paul Wai [phon], for Foday Sankoh to go to Freetown to take over the government that was there. It was at that time that they went and later I was released, relieved from my post and sent there to see Foday Sankoh at a place commonly called Combat Camp.

  • Okay, thank you. First, Mr Witness, I want to clarify something. In Liberian English do you sometimes refer to Sierra Leone as Freetown? Do you refer to the country?

  • Yes, the whole of Sierra Leone we consider to be Freetown, yes.

  • Thank you. Now, you said you were relieved of your post and sent there to see Foday Sankoh. Who relieved you of your post and sent you to see Foday Sankoh?

  • Basically from the beginning, from taking me from my post, that was directed by Charles Taylor after the Special Forces had gone with the first phase to Freetown and had failed. The Freetown forces pushed them back to Foya. It was at that time that he sent for me at Harbel Hill and another man to Visalah and be there until I received the last instruction to go to Freetown. I mean Sierra Leone.

  • Your Honours, I believe the witness said Visalah, V-I-S-A-L-A-H.

  • Commonly known as Combat Camp.

  • And Harbel Hill, H-A-R-B-E-L:

  • Now, Mr Witness, you said Charles Taylor gave you that assignment. Can you tell us how well Charles Taylor knew you at that time?

  • Your Honour, let me tell you one thing. I am the single Zigzag Mazhar. There is no second one. I am competent indeed and I used to battle indeed to the best of his expectation and he had a trust in me. So, for this reason, wherever the target was heard, at times he will send for me to deploy me there, yes. That was how he sent for me from Camp Schefflein highway to send me to Lofa and Visalah to meet with Sankoh to go into Sierra Leone.

  • Thank you. Now, when you went to Visalah, what happened?

  • You know, when I went to Visalah, at the time most Special Forces were there like Anthony Menquenagbeh and some others. Most of them were dead when I went. At that time Sam Bockarie was a small boy.

  • I believe the interpretation missed something and I don't believe the witness said most of them were dead. The transcript has "dead".

  • I said most of them present now were there. Some of them died during the war.

  • Mr Witness, when you went to Visalah and you met some of these people there, to your knowledge had a group already entered Sierra Leone?

  • They entered, but they couldn't make it. The force couldn't make it to maintain the ground. For this reason I was ordered, along with some other men, to go and march with the remaining men in Visalah to go back to Sierra Leone. That is what I said.

  • Thank you. Did you enter Sierra Leone?

  • When you were in Sierra Leone, Mr Witness, did you ever see Foday Sankoh?

  • Tell us about the first time you saw Foday Sankoh in Sierra Leone?

  • Yes. You know, when we went back and recaptured Koindu as far as to Buedu, when Foday Sankoh went there I saw him again when he went to visit us where we had captured and where we were maintaining.

  • So, at that time you said you had captured Koindu, correct?

  • Koindu, including Buedu.

  • What did you observe Foday Sankoh to do when he arrived?

  • You know, Foday Sankoh at that time, at the time that he was alive, he was a woman man. When he saw the action, when he saw where the action had taken place, where the destruction had taken place, he started crying, he started putting things together. When he saw the other body there, he would put his hand on his head and he [sic] immediately went to the radio room and called my leader, Charles Taylor, and said, "Oh, old man Charles Taylor, the man that is here is beginning to cry about what was happening here." That is Sankoh. Later he told me --

  • What I understood from the interpretation is that "he" went to the radio room. Who went to the radio room?

  • I went to the radio room and lodged Sankoh's complaint for him not to confuse the forces that were moving. He, as leader, cannot see destruction and start crying. That was my reason for lodging his complaint with Charles Taylor.

  • And when you say destruction, what was it that Foday Sankoh saw there in Sierra Leone?

  • He saw some of the corpses of soldiers, some corpses of civilians, some houses burned down. Many things had happened. We are talking about war.

  • When you say you called - you "lodged Sankoh's complaint for him not to confuse the forces", first of all when you went to the radio room - and please try to speak slowly, Mr Witness. When you went to the radio room, who did you call on the radio?

  • I called our leader, Charles Taylor. I told him about Sankoh's behaviour. He is considered as our leader to fight under him. He should not look at the first operation and start crying. That was my reason I went into the radio room and called Charles Taylor to lodge Sankoh's complaint and I did that.

  • Thank you. Now, when you complained about Foday Sankoh's behaviour to Charles Taylor, how did he respond?

  • Over the radio at that time, I think some of the Sierra Leonean boys called Sankoh and told him that, "Zigzag is making a complaint about you to Charles Taylor." Charles Taylor told me to continue the operation and that he will get used to it, Sankoh will get used to it, but continue the operation.

  • Okay, thank you. How long were you in Sierra Leone for?

  • At that time I think I spent three or four months, something like that, yes.

  • I am sorry to interrupt, your Honour, but I wonder if we could know what time that was.

  • Your Honour, in fact that was my next question, but I would appreciate, as a matter of procedure, that we don't - that each party does not suggest questions to the other:

  • Sir, do you recall what year it was that you went into Sierra Leone?

  • Don't rush it. I am answering every question. In 1991 I can't recall the days that we entered in Sierra Leone. I spent a few months before they sent for me to go to the Schefflein highway.

  • Thank you. Is Schefflein highway in Liberia?

  • What were your assignments after you returned to Liberia?

  • My assignment was with the 1st Battalion, but served so many units. Within the 1st Battalion we established combat units which Augustine Weah, who was a Special Forces commander, was to go as far as Bannerville Estate in Monrovia.

  • Can you tell us what other assignments you had in the NPFL and its successors? You said you were with the 1st Battalion. Did you have any other assignments?

  • Yes, I can say I served nearly all the units within the NPFL. I served the 1st Battalion, then I served the EMPG in Gbarnga, from there I served the death squad, from there I served jungle fire unit, from there I served the combat unit. So, you know, I was just an operational man for Charles Taylor.

  • Thank you. Now, you have mentioned the death squad. Can you tell us what was the death squad?

  • Yes, the death squad was purposely there for execution. It could be a soldier - in case you were a soldier and did not go by Charles Taylor's instruction. When he tells you to halt and you did not halt and others need to execute you, I will execute you, and I did that twice.

  • I am sorry, can you explain. What did you do twice?

  • When I said twice I mean things that happened more than 50 times, more than 100 times. If you ask me to explain where and how it happened, then of course I will explain it.

  • Are you saying that you performed executions?

  • Did anyone order you to do these executions?

  • Yes, yes. I was ordered by Charles Taylor because the government was a government - was a constitutional government that was governing the State and people should not do things without his order. That is Charles Taylor's order.

  • Okay, thank you. We will come back to that issue shortly, but first, Mr witness, I want to ask you, you have told us about in 1991 spending some time, some months, in Sierra Leone. Did you receive any other - did you perform any other missions to Sierra Leone?

  • In Sierra Leone the instruction I get from Charles Taylor before moving there to capture the ground, I will say the truth and nothing but the truth, was that there should be no consideration. The forces in Freetown are powerful, so there should be no consideration for the forces there and you should perform.

  • Mr Witness, I am asking you now about times after 1991. In particular, let me ask you first: Was there a time when ULIMO forces occupied Lofa County in Liberia?

  • When the ULIMO forces occupied Lofa County at that time, the Government of Sierra Leone opened the road from the capital city as far as to Koindu, so there was no way to go through to Sierra Leone.

  • [Microphone not activated] Mr Koumjian, but I note the time and I think the time for the break has arrived. We will therefore adjourn and take the mid-morning break and resume Court at 12.00. Please adjourn Court.

  • [Break taken at 11.30 a.m.]

  • [Upon resuming at 12.00 p.m.]

  • Please proceed, Mr Koumjian.

  • Mr Witness, just to remind you because of the interpretation if you could speak a little slower than normal and pause for a second every few sentences. Sir, when we stopped you mentioned that there was a time when it was impossible for you to travel to Sierra Leone because ULIMO had blocked the road at Lofa County and Sierra Leone government forces were on the road to Koidu. During that time did you ever receive an order related to Sierra Leone?

  • Yes.

  • What were you asked to do?

  • At the time ULIMO was in Lofa we were still in Gbarnga, that was the headquarters for Charles Taylor, and at that time Charles Taylor instructed me because there was no-one to penetrate through with ammunition or arms and I was asked by Charles Taylor and I was ordered by him, he in fact issued me a Nissan pick-up and he gave me 1,600 United States dollars in order to buy kola nuts to establish relationship with the borderline through Yekepa in Nimba County which I did.

    I made two trips with kola nuts and I established friendship with one Mandingo woman and that Mandingo woman's husband was a customs officer for Guinea. Later when I crossed for the first time I offered the man a balawala [phon] bag of kola nuts. At that time a Special Forces was assigned in Guinea as the Liberian ambassador. I made two trips and the woman's husband by the name Bangura was free handed to me. He used to help me to help me put my kola nuts in the car as far as Kissidugu and that was where --

  • Your Honours, the witness used a name, Tiagen or what. It's not clear to the interpreter.

  • Mr Witness, the interpreter did not hear the name of the place that sounded like Tiagen. Could you please repeat the name, please.

  • I said the Tiagen Wantee, Special Forces.

  • Your Honour, Tiagen Wantee, the first name is spelled T-I-A-G-E-N, second W-A-N-T-E-E:

  • So, sir, you indicate that you made two trips after establishing the relationship between this woman and her husband who was with customs in Guinea. Did you ever bring anything then through Guinea?

  • Yes, it was from that two trips that he was convinced and each time I was ready to go at that time I would carry some ammunition for Charles Taylor, like rockets. I used to put them in small bags and I would put them inside the kola nuts that had the balawala bags and each time I crossed I will offer Bangura some kola nut bags. From there he would escort me as far as Kissidugu. And at that time the late Musa Cisse had a Mandingo friend that used to come with Tiagen Wantee who used to collect these kola nuts and they would take it to the Liberian embassy, yes.

  • Okay. We understood that you said that the Mandingo friend of Musa Cisse would collect the kola nuts and take it to the embassy. Did they collect anything besides kola nuts from you?

  • Musa Cisse is not my friend. Musa Cisse is not my friend.

  • You misunderstood me. I didn't say that. Let me try to ask the question again. We understood you to say that the Mandingo friend of Musa Cisse, the Mandingo was a friend of Musa Cisse --

  • Okay.

  • This person would collect the kola nuts and take them to the Liberian embassy in Guinea?

  • Was it only kola nuts that you were giving to this person?

  • No, no. The first two trips were to establish relationship with the securities for them to be convinced that I am a businessman, but the rest of the other eight or 11 trips I had some ammos with some rockets inclusive and when I carried it sometimes I would give Bangura two bags of balawala kola nut bags and he would be encouraged to escort me as far as Kissidugu and then the Liberian ambassador. A Special Forces Tiagen Wantee would come along with Musa Cisse's friend to receive these items, which were kola nuts mixed up with these ammunitions, to receive them from me and take them as far as Conakry to the - at the Liberian embassy. That is what I said, here him sitting there.

  • Thank you, Mr Witness. Can you tell us these nuts and these weapons and the nuts, the weapons you said were taken to the embassy in Conakry. Did you have any information about what the ultimate destination of these weapons was, or ammunition? Was it only to go to the embassy in Conakry?

  • No, no. It was something when Tiagen carrying it, the late Jungle commonly known as Daniel Tamba, he knew the jungle between Guinea and Sierra Leone and he would take it from the embassy and he would carry it. So Jungle too was assigned with Tiagen Wantee and that was his mission for which he was assigned there, and my own mission was to take it from Gbarnga from Charles Taylor to escort it as far as Kissidugu. That was what I said.

  • Thank you. Now you've indicated you took the ammunition and rockets from Gbarnga from Charles Taylor. Where exactly in Gbarnga did you get the ammunition and rockets?

  • From the mansion. From Charles Taylor's mansion at Bofell Hill [phon]. That was where the ammunitions were stored in his warehouse.

  • Thank you. Now you've indicated this happened when ULIMO controlled Lofa County. After ULIMO disarmed, did you make any trips to Sierra Leone?

  • Plenty times, plenty times, and at that time the road was free to me. Many times. If you ask, I will name them.

  • Can you just give us an estimate of how many trips you made to Sierra Leone? Give us some idea.

  • I made trips to Sierra Leone at the time Mosquito was there up to Issa Sesay's administration. So it was more than 20, 30 to 40 trips.

  • Thank you. On those trips would you carry anything to or from Sierra Leone?

  • Yes, I carried arms, ammos including some artillery pieces, chasers. We had one of Charles Taylor's friends, a white guy with a big stomach. He used to bring some artillery pieces. I escorted it there so many times.

  • Now, you mentioned chasers. Can you tell the Court what chasers are?

  • At first when I saw it I thought it was RPG barrel, but it is long like from here to here [indicated]. But the rocket's mantle under it was very small. The rocket was very small. It was like green. It had a cloth by the butt and a cloth by the nozzle. That rocket, we used to get it from one of his friends, a white guy who used to bring it there. That was the time I saw that weapon.

  • May the record reflect, your Honours, if counsel agrees to the estimate, that when the witness was describing the length of the chaser he held his arms apart approximately one metre.

  • Do you know what a chaser was for?

  • The chaser was purposefully for jet bombers. At that time the ECOMOG troops were in Freetown. The chaser was for the jet bombers because they were giving us hard time.

  • Mr Witness, you've talked about these trips to Sierra Leone. Were you doing these on your own, or were you doing them pursuant to orders?

  • No. I will say the truth and nothing but the truth and at this time I can't recall most of those things, but at this present moment I will tell you Ecclesiastes chapter 3 says that everything happens three times. It is now the time for me to tell you the truth. I took direct instructions from Charles Taylor, I have not said any other person, and it was a government that had a constitution that governed the country led by him, Charles Taylor. So, anything we did was by his orders.

  • The ammunition and rockets and arms that you carried, where did you get them from, these that you took to Sierra Leone?

  • Mostly some were kept in his house at White Flower and at times when they rush us to take plane --

  • Your Honour, I believe the witness said "Russian".

  • When the Russian cargo goes, when the Russian cargo plane, a big plane.

  • Sorry, please continue. I asked you where you got the ammunition from and you said "White Flower and at times when the Russian plane ..."?

  • At times when the cargo plane came at a late hour sometimes we will go to the airport, and then whilst I would be going to White Flower I would take some to his house and by Charles Taylor's directive I would take some straight to Sierra Leone.

  • Thank you. Mr Witness --

  • Mr Witness, I would remind you you should be facing the judges. Try and avoid turning around and looking elsewhere. Thank you.

  • Mr Witness, when you were in Sierra Leone did you ever see diamonds?

  • I saw diamonds many times. Many times I saw diamonds and I escorted diamonds to Charles Taylor and that he himself can attest to, if he can say the truth.

  • When you took diamonds to Charles Taylor were you always alone, or did you do that in the company of others?

  • Most of the staff would be present like Benjamin Yeaten, Musa Cisse, Kai who was the houseboy to him, so many officials, but mainly when I was ready to hand them over to him maybe two or three people will be in his private office.

  • Mr Witness, did you ever escort anyone else carrying diamonds from Sierra Leone?

  • Yes, I escorted diamonds over 10/15 times, but the one that was actually encouraging was the passport sized diamond in the shape of a human being. That was the one that encouraged him and I was not alone that carried it. I went along with Mosquito, Benjamin Yeaten and Joe Tuah. We entered in the fence and it was something heavy. It was a passport sized diamond. It was big. It was actually big.

  • Thank you. Now, Mr Witness, I want to ask you about this occasion with what you called a passport sized diamond. You mentioned Mosquito and can you make it clear which person you're referring to on this occasion when you say "Mosquito"?

  • Sam Bockarie.

  • Mr Witness, when you first saw this diamond were you in Liberia, or were you in some other place?

  • In Sierra Leone. When I went to Sierra Leone with ammos Mosquito showed me this diamond and a few other diamonds that were around it, and from there we took the diamonds to Monrovia at White Flower to Charles Taylor and again I saw the diamond, yes.

  • Now, this particular diamond you said was shaped like a human head [sic]. Can you just show us with your hands or fingers how big the stone was?

  • The diamond, you know, it was like a shoulder part diamond that you can cut from here and it was like dressed up in a human being form. A passport sized diamond, like a real human being. It's just like when they carve something with their hand and it's like - it looked like it had a hair plate, but it was big, a passport sized diamond. Just like from here. I'm sorry, my fingers are now ugly. Just like from here up. [Indicated]

  • I'm better in inches than centimetres, but it looked like about one inch. It would be about two-and-a-half/three centimetres.

  • I just want to be clear. Mr Witness, are you saying it was from here to here? [Indicated]

  • No. From where this of my second breaking point is, like this. [Indicated] Bring it up.

  • Your Honour, it's about five centimetres.

  • But it was wide. It was real passport like something.

  • For the purpose of record, the witness has indicated a size using the upper part of his fingers which has been measured as five centimetres.

  • Mr Witness, you've indicated that Bockarie showed you this diamond in Sierra Leone. What did he do then with the diamond?

  • When I went and Sam Bockarie showed me the diamond I said, "Oh, this particular one, if Charles Taylor see it he will be very happy", because at that time we used to call him Father. If he saw it he would be happy. And when we took it along Charles Taylor was impressed and he even gave us some money and we took enough ammo back to Sierra Leone, yes.

  • Just before we move off, Mr Koumjian, the witness said something about shoulder and indicated a size on his shoulders. That did not seem to follow through from the next part.

  • I think he was describing the width of the - or the shape and width of the diamond.

  • That was the shape of the diamond. I said pass - it looked like passport size. In the front it was like a cut around here, but it was not as if it was a real human being like I am seated here. But it was a cut from here going up and the width of it was like this of my two fingers.

  • Let me just ask the witness to draw the form to size on a piece of paper.

  • I have no objection to that.

  • Mr Witness, draw the shape of the diamond in the same size that the diamond was.

  • [Witness complied] In fact, if there was something to put it on that paper it would have been more than what I have drawn there. That's why I called it passport size.

  • Mr Witness, when you say "passport size" are you talking about the passport book, or part of the book?

  • No, when you sit down and they take your photograph they will snap you and then they will take the picture and put it into the book. It is not the book itself.

  • Your Honour, I hesitate to interrupt, but I wonder if for the assistance of everyone if the drawing that the witness did could be displayed on the screen so that we can all see it.

  • Also, Mr Koumjian, you did ask the witness to draw according to size, the actual size. Is this now according to the actual size? Should that be --

  • Your Honour, I can ask that again. That is what I asked.

  • I wonder if while my learned friend is doing that if he could explain what the square is at the bottom of the diagram that he's drawn.

  • Okay, Mr Witness, you can go and stand by the drawing that you did for these questions. Now it appears to - I think everyone would agree that you have drawn what looks like a head and then a box below the head. Which is the diamond? Which is the shape, or is all of it the shape of the diamond that you saw?

  • All of this. That's the diamond. All of this. This is the diamond. [Indicated] It had the neck, the head and the diamond itself, but it was a complete diamond, but not an ordinary head, but it was diamond. Everything stuck together was the diamond in the form of a picture of a human being.

  • Thank you. And when you say photograph - you can sit back at the other seat now. That's fine. When you say a photograph of a human being, do I understand you to mean the shape of a photograph that would be in a passport? That part of a human being?

  • Yes, yes.

  • Now, did you draw on that paper the size of the diamond that you saw? Is that the size, the width and length approximately equal to what you saw?

  • You know, actually the diamond, if it was something to be presented here it would have been larger than this because the diamond was big and it was just like a real human being, yes.

  • Thank you. Now, were you actually present when Bockarie gave the diamond to Taylor?

  • I told you that Bockarie and I took these diamonds from Sierra Leone to Taylor and he hand delivered it in my presence and after delivering it he offered an envelope to each and every one of us.

  • What was in - I'm sorry. May the drawing perhaps receive an MFI number?

  • A hand drawing on a lined piece of paper will become MFI-17, I think it is. MFI-17.

  • Mr Witness, what was in the envelope that was handed to you by Charles Taylor?

  • Money. United States dollars. US dollars. Mine roughly was about 2,000 plus. Because it has taken a long time I can't give you the accurate amount, but it was above - more than 2,000 United States dollars. But Sam Bockarie's own was a little heavier, but he didn't open it in my presence.

  • Now, Mr Witness, after this delivery of diamonds did Sam Bockarie ever return to Liberia?

  • When we gave these diamonds Charles Taylor gave us some money and the next day he called G4 Moses and Kai. Yes, he went back to Liberia. Sam Bockarie went back to Liberia.

  • And do you know - you mentioned that Charles Taylor called the G4 Moses Ngai and I believe that's been spelled before --

  • The G4 Moses Duoh is different and Kai who was assigned directly under Taylor is different, but it was Kai who had the warehouse key. The two warehouses from where we used to get the material from, the ammo warehouse that was attached to Charles Taylor's house that had its - that faced the other side, it was Kai that had the key, but before getting the ammos it was G4 Moses who was in charge. Before you take the ammos and the arms you will stand before him. He will take the papers and then he will give it to Moses and Moses would take the papers to Charles Taylor for him to sign them.

  • So, Mr Witness, was it necessary in order to obtain ammunition that you have a paper signed by Charles Taylor?

  • Most times yes, yes. Any ammo that we received, they bring document, we sign, then Moses will take it to Kai and Kai will take it to Charles Taylor, based upon the amounts that we were receiving to carry, but he cannot sign it. We who would be receiving it, we sign for it.

  • I may have confused you with my question. After giving the diamond to Taylor, where did Sam Bockarie go? That was my fault, but can you please state that again?

  • After we had given the diamond to Charles Taylor, we spent a day in Monrovia. The following day Sam Bockarie returned. I escorted him to Buedu with enough ammos, rockets, GPMGs, about 15 new ones with belt felt.

  • Sorry, I didn't get the last word the interpreter used. Bell fell?

  • Belt felt for the GMG where they put the rounds.

  • Sir, did you ever see Sam Bockarie return with diamonds to Liberia?

  • Yes. When we went with the material under the directives of Charles Taylor, before we arrived Issa brought some diamonds in a small jar, just like this glass here, but the mouth was small, almost to the end of the jar, and we took it back to Liberia.

  • The witness was referring to the glass which was described by the Court yesterday. The same glass:

  • When you took this jar of diamonds back to Charles Taylor, what happened then?

  • After we had taken this jar, that was the time that Charles Taylor called Musa Cisse in my presence. I will say the truth and nothing but the truth. In my presence Charles Taylor told - he called Musa Cisse and said, "These boys were doing extremely well. It will be better if I do a recommendation for him and you to go to Burkina Faso to sign for ammunition for himself", and that he did and later Mosquito, Eddie Kanneh, Mike Lamin, Musa Cisse, they left and went.

  • They went where, Mr Witness?

  • And do you recall if Sam Bockarie ever came back to Monrovia after he left for that trip?

  • Yes, they returned. After a week and five days they returned. When they returned even Eddie Kanneh brought some pictures for me from where they went on a step. After they had returned at one time in the night we were sitting in a club on a drinking table, then Sam Bockarie received a call from his phone.

  • Your Honours, can he repeat the name of the phone?

  • Just pause, Mr Witness. Sorry, Mr Interpreter, please repeat that.

  • The name of the phone. He referred to a phone.

  • Please repeat the name of the phone, Mr Witness. It wasn't heard clearly.

  • I said after they left when they went to Burkina they spent a week and five days and they returned; they and Eddie Kanneh - Eddie Kanneh, Mike Lamin with Sam Bockarie and Musa Cisse. Musa Cisse came along with them.

  • Mr Witness, you were saying that you were at a club drinking at a table and Sam Bockarie received a call on his phone. What kind of phone was that? Can you give us the name of the type of phone?

  • It was Thuraya satellite phone. I was in possession of one.

  • Your Honours, the spelling is T-H-U-R-I-Y-A:

  • After Sam Bockarie received a call on this phone, what did he do?

  • He rushed in to where I was sitting down and he said, "Top Bra, let's go", and I said, "All the drinks we have here?", and he said, "Let's go". So, we left and went to White Flower. At the time we went, Benjamin Yeaten, Joe Tuah, Peter Saikpedeh, they were all at the White Flower's front door and they said, "Your materials have arrived. Your ammos have come". Then we left and went to the airport.

    When we went I saw the Russian cargo plane. It came with enough ammos and arms which we were not able to offload. We were not able to haul everything to Monrovia that night. We left some there at the cargo warehouse at Roberts International Airport. Then we took some - in two days we took some, Mosquito and I, Eddie Kanneh, Mike Lamin, FOC, the late FOC, Victor Kallon - Victor Kallon. Morie Kallon is different. Victor Kallon. We left them there and we got into the car, two trucks, a pick-up and a jeep. We escorted the first trip, yeah.

  • Mr Witness, I'm going to go over that a little bit slowly and again ask you to speak slowly for the interpreter. Now you said when Sam Bockarie came back from receiving the phone call he said "Top Brass". What does the word "Top Brass" or name mean? Who is that?

  • I was the one they called Top Bra. Over there they called me so many names. They called me Zigzag, they called me Top Bra, they called me [indiscernible], they called me Five-O-Five, they called me Jungle Broom. Yes, these are my names.

  • Your Honour, the spelling I believe that the witness is pronouncing, Top Brass, T-O-P B-R-A-S-S:

  • So you said that after the phone call you all rushed to the Roberts International Airport. Is that correct?

  • We were not rushed directly. We rushed to White Flower to Charles Taylor's house. It was there that we met Benjamin Yeaten, Joe Tuah and Peter Saikpedeh there. Later Mosquito went inside from there. Then they took us to the airport. We went and I said at the time I saw a Russian cargo plane, a very big plane loaded with ammos and ammunition - I mean ammunition and arms.

  • And the name Peter Saikpedeh, the last name is spelled S-A-I-K-P-E-D-E-H.

  • He was one of the Special Forces.

  • Now, you've described that the plane was full of ammunition. Can you tell us what kind of ammunition was in the plane?

  • Some were LAR rounds, AK rounds, GPMG, 32 PC, and some GPMG barrels. Enough, yes. These were the materials that were in the plane.

  • For those of us not so familiar with weapons, GPMG barrels, by barrels do you mean - is that a gun?

  • And you've mentioned LAR rounds. What is LAR?

  • It's a rifle. It's a rifle. The round - the rounds of that rifle is what I'm talking about.

  • Now, you mentioned you were not able to take all of the ammunition to White Flower that night. What did you use to transport the ammunition to White Flower?

  • In Monrovia Charles Taylor was having so many trucks and these trucks, two were assigned directly to me to escort arms and ammunition, but that night there were some trucks that were headed by Joe Tuah, one of the Special Forces, some trucks headed by Peter Saikpedeh there and some headed by Benjamin Yeaten. I led the other two, but we were not able to overhaul everything at night.

  • Thank you.

  • The only thing we did was that we offloaded the plane, because when the plane comes we don't want that plane - day to break on that airplane. So, we offloaded the plane at all costs and stored the materials in the cargo warehouse at the airport.

  • So, how many trucks in total carried ammunition from the airport that night?

  • If I'm not mistaken it's about - it's six or five, if I'm not mistaken.

  • Can you give us some idea of the size of these trucks, of how much they could carry?

  • No, I can't give account of that, but the trucks were big, the one I was using.

  • Your Honours, can he repeat the brand of truck? It's not very clear.

  • Mr Witness, can you tell us the name of the kind of truck again, please.

  • Mack truck. My own. The one that I was using. My own Mack truck, a yellow truck.

  • Mr Witness, did this appear to be a lot of ammunition to you?

  • Repeat.

  • The ammunition that arrived that night, based on your prior experience was that a lot of ammunition to arrive in Liberia?

  • Yes, yes. Like the chaser, the chaser that came with our chief Charles Taylor's friend, the four white guys, they were many. Many times. Even the other truck - the other plane that came at the second to the last time that had the accident on the runway with our ammos which he Charles Taylor - when Charles Taylor had stopped all international security not to go to the airport again, we were able to produce eight to nine trucks.

  • I want to concentrate now on this ammunition that arrived - that came just after Sam Bockarie returned from Burkina Faso and you said Sam Bockarie got the call about the arrival of the plane. Was Sam Bockarie at the airport when the ammunition was being unloaded?

  • Sam Bockarie and I rode in the same car. We rode the same jeep. Then my driver who was assigned with me, [indiscernible] and Benjamin Yeaten, they had their own truck. Yes, but he - he was not on the field at the same time. We were in Monrovia city in the nightclub when he received the call that the plane had arrived with the ammo.

  • Mr Witness, the next day after the plane had arrived and the ammunition had been unloaded, what did you do?

  • We were happy. The following day we rested all day. I think we spent two days in the city. It was the following night that we took off, because we couldn't have left during the day.

  • Mr Witness, when you say "We took off", first of all who was travelling with you?

  • At the time that we took the first trip from White Flower with the ammos I went along with Eddie Kanneh, Mosquito, Mike Lamin, including their bodyguards. One was called FOC, Victor Kallon, Yellow Man. I can't remember all those boys, yes.

  • On that trip what vehicles did you take?

  • We used two Mack trucks, the trucks I was using. The two yellow Mack trucks with the jeep and the pick-up.

  • To Sierra Leone. We passed through Bong County, we got to Lofa, passed through Voinjama, Kolahun, Foya and entered through Buedu.

  • What were you carrying in those vehicles on this trip?

  • I told you the arms and the ammo that came, but the first one that came were enough ammos that we carried. That was what was in the car. But the jeep that we were in, there was no ammo in there, but it was in front of me escorting those items. So when they see me they will know straightaway that I was the one travelling with those trucks and there would be no embarrassment through Charles Taylor's directive.

  • I just want to be clear about what was being carried. In the trucks what were you carrying, if anything?

  • I said ammo. Ammo, ammo, ammo. I repeat, ammo, ammo, that can be put in a gun to shoot. That's what I'm talking about. It's not something different. We cannot carry an empty truck.

  • Thank you. Now the ammunition that you were carrying, you indicated that this plane had arrived, you called it the Russian cargo plane at Roberts International Airport, and you had unloaded the ammo from that plane. Did you take all of the ammo from that plane on this trip to Sierra Leone?

  • No, we did not carry them on the same time. I said the ammo was plenty. What we did was that we offloaded the truck - I mean we offloaded the plane and stored these ammos and arms in at IRIA cargo warehouse. The one we were able to haul that night, we took them to Charles Taylor's residence at White Flower in Monrovia. At the time they were hauling overnight we were resting. We spent two days. The following night we took off from Monrovia with the two yellow trucks and a pick-up, plus the jeep. That's what I'm saying.

    Anyway, I'm very sorry, you see my head, I've got a problem, so you too should take your time to ask me. You see this head? You see here? Through my ears, I can breathe through my ears, do you see? You hear that? So you must take your time too. The rocket burst this side.

  • Okay, I'll take my time and, you're right, it will be better if we all speak slowly and take our time.

  • So, Mr Witness, what happened to the ammunition that came from that plane that you were not able to take to Sierra Leone on this trip with Sam Bockarie and the two yellow trucks?

  • It was plenty. I told you that the cargo plane, it's a big plane and the ammos that were inside were plenty to attempt making two trips with it. So after we carried the first trip I think I spent two or three weeks in Sierra Leone and I started coming back with the yellow truck, with the pick-up and the jeep and I started hauling it overnight. After the first trip, I think I made about four or five trips before I finished those items.

  • Thank you. So if I understand you correctly after the first trip with the trucks you made four or five additional trips taking the rest of the ammunition to Sierra Leone. Is that correct?

  • Thank you. Now, Mr Witness, you've talked about Sam Bockarie and you said at one time you were going to Sierra Leone during the Sam Bockarie time and later during the Issa Sesay time. Can you tell us what happened? Where did Sam Bockarie go when he no longer was --

  • Your Honours, it appears that my learned friend is moving away from the topic of that arms shipment. It might be helpful to all concerned if we were to be told when that was supposed to have happened. It's very difficult to cross-examine on a topic like that without that kind of foundational detail.

  • Your Honours, the Prosecution has its own reasons for conducting examination in a certain way. Many witnesses have talked about the trip to Burkina Faso and the arrival of Sam Bockarie back from Burkina Faso. The time period, we believe, is well established by other witnesses and we don't believe it's productive at this point to go and ask this witness to recollect the year 10 years later.

  • Your Honours, this is completely ridiculous because the Court will recall that when I cross-examined [redacted] he denied that there was any such shipment from Burkina Faso.

  • Just pause. Please be careful. A name just mentioned will be redacted from the record. Continue.

  • Your Honour, it's a name mentioned by the witness himself during the course of the proceedings this morning.

  • I've made an order. Please continue, Mr Griffiths.

  • Your Honour, it seems to me only fair that if the Prosecution are putting a case then they should put it in sufficient detail for us to be able to respond.

  • Thank you, Mr Griffiths. I'm clear on the point.

  • We are of the view that it is reasonable to set a time frame and we uphold the objection.

  • Is your Honour requiring the Prosecution to do that, because the Defence of course has free rein in cross-examination to ask that question?

  • Mr Koumjian, I'm sure you're not intending to challenge what I've said. However, to circumvent this I will ask the witness. Mr Witness, you have described a plane coming, you've described the type of plane and you've described what happened after it came. When did that happen?

  • Let me be bold to tell you I will say the truth and nothing but the truth. By being chief of operation for Charles Taylor I had so many occasions that I can't recall all today. I had Sierra Leone problem on my hand, I had Guinea problem on my hand, I had Ivory Coast problem on my hand, so I cannot recall all of these dates to be exact, but I can remember the happenings and tell you.

  • So. You don't recall the date. Thank you, Mr Witness. We're clear now.

  • Okay, because I was the operation man for Charles Taylor. You can ask him himself. He gave me three countries to attend to. That was the problem.

  • Please, we're not criticising you in any way, Mr Witness. Please do not think that.

  • Okay, okay. Thank you.

  • Your Honours, the interpreter would like to make a correction. The witness used the word "haul" which I inadvertently repeated after him. That could have been interpreted to mean transporting.

  • I do recall you saying it and I understand when you said "haul". Thank you.

  • Mr Witness, you've mentioned Sam Bockarie being in Sierra Leone. Do you know if Sam Bockarie stayed in Sierra Leone, or did he ever leave the country?

  • Sam Bockarie, at last he and Issa had a conflict. Our leader Charles Taylor sent me, Joe Tuah, Peter Saikpedeh and we went and received Sam Bockarie, took him from Sierra Leone to Monrovia. After we had arrived in Monrovia he was at my house. Charles Taylor leased a house for him at 14 houses. That was where he was and to go to Burkina Faso for him to prepare for Ivory Coast war. He was not in Liberia.

  • When Sam Bockarie left Sierra Leone and came to Monrovia, did he come alone or did anyone - did he bring anyone with him?

  • He came with let's say they were many. Over three to five, more than that. They were many. Because the truck in which we carried - I didn't check it, but all these vehicles were full of human beings when he arrived in Monrovia. During his departure for Burkina some of these men were deployed in various units in Liberia and some were taken away by Charles Taylor's friend, the white man with a big belly, for them to go for in-service training for Babylon to fall.

  • Now you've indicated that the men that came with Bockarie, some of them were put into various units. First of all, at that time when Bockarie came back, came to Monrovia with these men, what unit were you in?

  • At the time that Sam Bockarie went to Monrovia I was working directly at the mansion, but you know I was chief of operations, yes. I didn't have any special unit, but I received salary under the SSS, yes.

  • Do you know if any of these soldiers were integrated into the SSS? Any of these soldiers that came with Bockarie?

  • Yes. Yes, some were with the SSS. Some were with the ATU, anti-artillery unit. Some were with the police. Some were with immigration also.

  • Now, Mr Witness, you've indicated that Bockarie had a conflict with Issa Sesay. Did you ever receive any orders subsequent to Sam Bockarie leaving Sierra Leone concerning Issa Sesay?

  • Yes, I received an instruction from Charles Taylor when he said I should go for Sam Bockarie, "I don't want him to have conflict with Issa and Issa has more fighting men under him once he was facing battle and Mosquito was in Buedu. You go and bring him". It was at that time that I, Peter Saikpedeh, Joe Tuah, went for him and brought his group of people, his group of people including his mother, his wife and his children.

  • Thank you. But after you had brought Sam Bockarie to Liberia, after that time did you ever receive any orders concerning Issa Sesay?

  • Can you tell us who gave you the order?

  • From time immemorial I was taking orders from my leader, Charles Taylor. When Issa Sesay was there I received orders to ammos for him. When Issa Sesay was there, there was some behaviours that he was putting up like signing documents with the UN. At that time I was in Kono, some UN people went there with a paper for Issa Sesay to sign. I called directly to Charles Taylor. From there he asked me whether I can execute Issa and I said, "Oh, chief, I am in Kono, the centre. I'm in the midst of these people. I cannot do anything". Then he said, "Come to Kailahun. I will call him to come for ammos in Buedu. Then you'll be able to execute him there". So I left Kono, I told Issa that I was trying to go and he gave me his jeep. I went and left --

  • Your Honours, can he repeat the river and the last bit of his testimony?

  • Pause, Mr Witness. The interpreter wants you to repeat the name of the river. You said, "I went and left" and continue from there, please, and repeat the name.

  • When I left Kono, I stopped at Mile Five River. I left the vehicle at Mile Five River, at the ferry, and I crossed over to Pendembu in the Kailahun District to wait for Issa to execute him under the directive of my leader Charles Taylor. Later he called me and said he had already sent for Issa to go and receive ammos in Buedu and for him to come and pass through me to Buedu and then I will follow him to get him, but Issa never returned. I spent almost two weeks in Kailahun and later he told me that, "The man has gone. He will no longer receive supplies from me."

  • Who told you that "The man has gone"?

  • I said Charles Taylor said. Charles Taylor has already connived. He has already connived.

  • Your Honour, the witness said "Issa had already connived" and the interpretation was "Charles Taylor".

  • I didn't say "he's gone". I said that he told me that "The man has already connived". I didn't say "he's gone". He has already connived. At that time I had spent two weeks in Kailahun waiting for Issa to execute him.

  • Mr Witness, you indicated that when you received the order from Charles Taylor to execute Issa Sesay that Issa Sesay had signed some paper. Do you know anything about what these papers were about?

  • In relation to the document I am not too sure, but what I saw in Kono, at the time that I went there, in my presence I took some ammos to Issa to transfer it to Morris Kallon in Makeni. But I was in Kono, some white guys went there with some UN people and the CO man said that the people came to the chief, Issa, for him to sign some documents. I asked what the document was for and he said for the peace agreement in Freetown.

    It was at that time that I left with those white guys and entered Issa's residence. I went into Issa's room, because I don't speak Krio so they won't notice that I am a Liberian. When they finished talking I used a bypass route and went to CO man who was in control of the diamond that we used to bring. I went to his house.

    It was there that I was - that I called over the Thuraya satellite and called to Charles Taylor that there was some white people from Freetown who'd come to Issa, but they said they had come there for peace agreement and he said, "The man wants to connive". Then he said, "Go to Kailahun and wait for him there. I will send for him". First he said, "You can execute him in Kono", and I said, "No, the group is large and if there were places like Pendembu or Kailahun I will be able to execute him". Then he said, "Okay, but then come to Kailahun. I will send for him to come".

    That's the time that I left Kono and went to Kailahun and waited there for over weeks - let's say for over two weeks - and Issa never returned. Later Charles Taylor called me and said, "The man has already connived. You can come back. He will no more receive supplies from me", because our operation, RUF is not different. NPFL is not different. Once you go across you go to Freetown you are an RUF. When you cross from Sierra Leone to Liberia you are NPFL. That was how the movement was like. We all took one instruction from Charles Taylor. Have I made myself clear?

  • Mr Koumjian, the witness has repeatedly used the word "connived" and I think it's been translated as "connived". I'm not sure that I understand really.

  • I'll enquire.

  • It means - yes, I understand. It means he has already associated himself with the people. He is not with us any longer. That means he has connived.

  • The UN troops that went from Freetown with a document for Issa to sign a peace agreement. It means he has associated himself with them, he will no more cooperate with us and so for that reason Issa should be executed in Kono. It was at that time that I said, "Chief, Charles Taylor, the group here is large", and he said, "Okay, come to the borderline and I'll send for him to go there".

  • Mr Witness, we understood that point. We're grateful for your explanation. Please continue, Mr Koumjian.

  • Mr Witness, we will get all of what you say if you speak a little slower. Now to the best that you can, can you give us an idea of what year this took place where Charles Taylor gave you the order to execute Issa Sesay?

  • That was the last trip that I made to Freetown, yes. The last trip. That was the last trip that I made to Freetown. I think at the end of 2002, or something like that, I was having more problems on my hands. So I can't just recall one and I was not expecting that we would sit down today explaining, because we were hoping we will not go anywhere. It was not something that we could have kept on record.

  • Thank you. Just to help us in determining the time, do you recall when you got this order if the RUF had completely disarmed?

  • At that time they said they disarmed the RUF, but I used to carry - we were still - we still had our arms under cover in Kono and Kailahun. RUF was not properly disarmed. Those who were disarmed were from Makeni, Tongo and some other areas there. Those were the people who were disarmed, but from Kono to coming towards Kailahun we were still in possession of weapons.

  • Okay. So we're clear, I understand you to be saying that it was after the disarmament process had begun, is that correct, when you got this order?

  • Yes.

  • Thank you. Now, Mr Witness, you've just told us about an order to execute that you received from Charles Taylor which you were unable to fulfil. Did you receive other orders from Charles Taylor to kill people that you were able to fulfil?

  • Plenty. I told you plenty. Plenty. If I have the chance, if you permit me, I can explain more than 10 to 15 times and if possible all day so that we wouldn't need any explanation any more.

  • Can you begin to tell us what you recall about orders you received from Charles Taylor to commit executions that you carried out?

  • It happened during the arrival of Charles Taylor when I received my first instruction from him to move from Gborplay, to go from Grey Tapeta, he said, "Wherever the armed forces of Liberia were based and you see any civilian there who was supporting those armed men, you shouldn't spare them. That will put fear in them to retreat". So for this reason I started executing from Grey Tapeta, Kamutes Town, as far as to Buchanan Port. Then from when Gbarnga fell in '94, I can remember the EMG battalion that was assigned with him directly --

  • Your Honours, can he repeat the - I think he called a name that was not clear to me.

  • Mr Witness, the interpreter requires you to repeat the name you have just used. You were talking, "I can remember the EMG battalion that was assigned". Please repeat the names.

  • The EMG battalion that was a special bodyguard. They were the special bodyguard assigned to Charles Taylor's mansion in bodyguard. You've got me clear.

  • Thank you. Please continue.

  • After the fall of Gbarnga --

  • Mr Koumjian, are these locations in Liberia, or Sierra Leone, or --

  • These are in Liberia.

  • In Liberia. The executions started in Liberia. The same motto of the NPFL in Liberia was the same motto of the RUF that continued in Sierra Leone. I told you previously that there was no difference between the RUF. There is no difference between RUF and NPFL.

  • You've mentioned the fall of Gbarnga and this battalion from the Executive Mansion Guard? What orders did you receive from Charles Taylor in regards to that battalion? Continue your explanation.

  • The order, that was the first time to form the Death Squad unit. That was the first time also to establish the SBU, the Small Boy Unit. [Indiscernible] was the commander.

    The INTERPRETER: Your Honours, can he repeat?

  • Just pause, Mr Witness. Mr Interpreter, repeat what?

  • The name of the commander, from there, of the Small Boys Unit.

  • Please repeat the name of the commander of the Small Boys Unit and continue your answer from there, Mr Witness.

  • Zupon [phon], Zupon. Yes, honourable judge, I told you I am one of the key players of the NPFL from the beginning to the end, so I will say the truth and nothing but the truth.

  • Sorry, Mr Witness, do not think I am challenging you in any way. It's when the interpreter doesn't hear properly and we all want to hear you clearly that I ask you to repeat things. I am only asking for clarity, you understand?

  • Okay. Thank you, sir. Thank you, sir. So after the fall of Gbarnga the EMPG battalion that was serving at the mansion in Gbarnga, they abandoned the war and the enemy that entered in Gbarnga, they went as far as between Nimba County and Bong County up to the bridge called Bella Bridge. Bella Bridge. So they were there putting people's children in the water, in the sea, saying that they've connived, executing some of them. So when Charles Taylor heard that at that time, then went for me at Grand Gedeh. When we got there we formed the Death Squad unit and they made me commander, but Benjamin Yeaten was the overall supervisor of the unit. He told me, "When you go to Bella, if it is true that EMPG unit were killing people, harassing people, you should execute them."

    For sure when I went there I saw some of them holding people - people's babies and throwing them in the river going down. So I sent my bodyguard Heavy D [phon] to go and talk with Jeongor [phon] - I mean, Jeongor. He wanted to shoot him and he ran and came to him. Then I shot among them and I killed few of them, about 49 or 59. They were many, you know? So I called that I have killed a few of them, over 50.

    Then he said, "You can continue your march". That was how Saddam, Pablo, Idi Amin, King GB, that's how we started marching on the road as far as to this place, this junction, in Bong County now. We started engaging the enemy from there and we went and stopped at Pedilay [phon] - I mean, I will call the name of the town. Kpallala. We stopped at Kpallala that very day after that execution. We started engaging the enemy from diamond junction to Kpallala - Kpallala Town. We slept. Around four we started our journey up to Gbao Town [phon]. So while we were in Gbao Town, Ben went there and established a Special Forces base. A Special Forces base in Gbao Town.

  • Pause, Mr Witness, because I want to get a proper record of the spelling of the names of some of the places you've mentioned. There have been quite a few, Mr Koumjian. Bella?

  • Kpallala, K-P-A-L-L-A-L-A.

  • Bella. Kpallala, okay. From Bella, Bella is in-between Nimba County and Bong County at the bridge. That was where the execution started. From Bella we started engaging the enemy from Gamu junction in Bong County to Kpallala. That was where we slept and took off around four in the morning. From Kpallala we made a brief stop --

  • I was just going to get the spelling of those two places. Just wait a little moment, please, Mr Witness, while we have them spelt and then we will ask you to continue.

  • Bella is B-E-L-L-A. The junction, I don't know if we got that --

  • Mr Witness, do you know how to spell that first word?

  • You see me, when you see me speaking some English it's because I have stayed long in the service, but I don't read and write.

  • We're not criticising you and if necessary, Mr Interpreter, have you any knowledge of the spelling of this place?

  • I will try, your Honour. I can only spell it phonetically. Which one of them?

  • G-A-M-U. That was where we started engaging ULIMO.

  • And the witness also mentioned Kpallah. That's K-P-A-L-L-A-H:

  • Okay, Mr Witness, I don't know if you've completed your answer, or if you have more?

  • I have not completed it yet. I told you when you talk about my execution it's more than a thousand, except if you say it should stop that far. From there when we got to Gbarnga Charles Taylor ordered me and we established the Jungle Fire Unit and he said, "From Gbarnga behind Belefuanai up to Belatui there is no enemy there ..." -- I mean, "There is no civilian there. Anyone who is there was in support of the enemy. I don't want to see any of them."

    It was at that time that we formed No Baby On Target. Be it ULIMO, or young baby, or you are an old man, we started executing everybody until the road was opened from Gbarnga to Belatui. It's so many if I continue we will on execution and time would go.

  • Your Honour, Belefuanai, B-E-L-A-F-U-A-N-A-I and Belatui I believe is B-E-L-A-T-U-I.

  • Again please, after Prince Johnson had captured Doe, he was happy to come with Doe to us. The group that --

  • I want to stop you, because I want to ask you some more details about something you just said before you move on to something new about this operation.

  • Okay, carry on.

  • Now, you said that Charles Taylor gave you an order regarding the civilians in that area. He said that, "There are no civilians there. I don't want to see any of them". What did that mean to you, "I don't want to see any of them"?

  • He said that the civilians on that side, they were in collaboration with the enemy forces. He said they were the ones who were passing information to the ULIMO and he said mostly it was those people's children who are fighting against us, so he said they should be executed and he said we should get rid of any one of them.

  • Was that order carried out?

  • Yes, we carried out that order starting from Gbarnga as far as Belatui. You can't walk like from here to the other side without seeing flies passing all over the corpses, all over the bushes and the villages, until we got rid of that place to re-enter Lofa.

  • What were the ages of the people that were killed and the corpses that were left?

  • You know, some were pregnant women. We even delivered them with pen knives some of the babies. We just - some of the babies, we just take them and knock their heads on the wall and they were dead. Some were girls. Both men, women and children.

  • Approximately how many civilians were killed?

  • I cannot give you the actual number, but they were many. Many, many more that were executed by Charles Taylor's orders.

  • Can you continue with telling us about executions you carried out on the orders of Charles Taylor?

  • Then after Prince Johnson captured Doe, that very day that Prince Johnson captured Doe, at that time I was in Gbarnga at the MP headquarters because we had just - we just heard at Bofell Hill then they said they have now caught Doe. They have now caught Doe. They will bring him tomorrow. Then we went to Bofell Hill in Charles Taylor's yard. And then those of us that he recognised we had access to enter into his yard, and then from there he gave instructions to Ben and then it's better for Prince Johnson to come here and then Ben just said, "Chief, it's up to you", and then he said, "The best thing, if that man will come here you will feel embarrassed so I know what to do". So he said the next step was for you to go to Fenna [phon] junction and from Fenna junction to Louisiana at the Upper Caldwell. He said, "You should set an ambush for him. Whilst he was coming, you should ambush him."

    But when we left there to go and ambush Prince Johnson, at that time Doe was not yet dead. It was the following day that we were doing these things. It was a hurried operation. We saw some group that were coming from Prince Johnson's base and they were jubilating that they had captured Doe and Prince Johnson was with them.

  • Your Honours, could the witness slow down his pace a little?

  • Mr Witness, again could you be a little slower so the interpreter can hear and repeat the last part of your answer so the interpreter can hear it properly, thank you.

  • I said after Prince Johnson's captured Doe, that very day I was in Gbarnga at the MP headquarters. We heard a heavy noise around Charles Taylor's fence at the mansion grounds in Gbarnga. We all rushed there, and those of us that he recognised we entered into his fence and from there he asked Benjamin Yeaten and he said, "You think if Prince comes here it will be all right?" And, you know, most of the Special Forces, Enoch Dogolea, Tiagen Wantee, [indiscernible], they made comments and they said, "If Prince comes here there will be problem", so he said, "Okay".

    From there they set up a quick operation for us to go and wait for Prince Johnson in order to execute him and get Doe from him, so we left. We took the route from Fenna junction and we went as far as Cassava Hill in Louisiana, that is Upper Caldwell. We were there waiting for Prince to come with Doe. But his first group of soldiers who were rejoicing, coming on the way, we thought Prince Johnson himself was amongst the group and I think they were in about four cars. We surrounded the cars. We had all those men and then Benjamin Yeaten called Charles Taylor and then he said, "Oh, Prince did not come", or he said, "Those group of people, you shouldn't allow them to go back and you shouldn't bring them here. You should execute them". And that was the time through him, Charles Taylor, and then that Ben said, "Chief said we should execute the people. He said we should execute them with knife". I think those men they were about 72 or 76, something like that. We executed them with knives that same day.

    But those who made it to escape from that, when they went back to Prince Johnson and when he heard the information that was the time Prince Johnson killed Doe. He decided not to go to Gbarnga. Then he sent Varney to follow and a group sent Colonel Varney to carry him. Those groups that Colonel Varney came with, we arrested them at night again and then we killed them with knives and those were all executions that we carried out through Charles Taylor's orders and even against Prince Johnson. So, the executions were so many that I cannot name all of them. Here, him sitting down himself.

  • Your Honour, the name Varney, V-A-R-N-E-Y. Enoch Dogolea, the spelling is --

  • Colonel Varney is now late.

  • E-N-O-C-H and the second name is D-O-G-O-L-E-A. I believe it's almost the time. I have other questions.

  • Indeed, Mr Koumjian, you're quite right. Mr Witness, it's now time for us to take the lunchtime break. We're going to have a break for one hour and then we will be hearing the continuation of your evidence when we return at 2.30.

  • Thank you, sir. Thank you. Yes, sir.

  • [Lunch break taken at 1.30 p.m.]

  • [Upon resuming at 2.30 p.m.]

  • Yes, please continue.

  • Madam President.

  • Madam President, the Prosecution would request a very brief private session to raise an issue of concern to the Prosecution. We also believe it would be better to do this not in the presence of the witness.

  • In that case I would request, first of all, that the witness be assisted to leave the Chamber and, secondly, if we could have assistance to have the Court put into a short private session. Private, I think I heard you correctly?

  • That is correct, Madam President.

  • [At this point in the proceedings, a portion of the transcript, pages 5909 to 5910, was extracted and sealed under separate cover, as the proceeding was heard in private session.]

  • [Open session]

  • We are back to open session, your Honour.

  • In the meantime if the witness can be brought. What I am saying I am saying now to those persons in the public gallery. I think two of the persons that are presently in the public gallery have been in the public gallery this morning. If in fact those gentlemen were here this morning, you may have heard a court order redacting a certain portion of the evidence - excuse me, not of the evidence, of a remark made by counsel. If that was heard that is not to be repeated in public because the person was the subject of certain court orders and the name is not to be repeated.

    Ms Hollis, does that cover your concerns?

  • Thank you, Madam President.

  • May I, your Honour?

  • Please proceed, Mr Koumjian. Thank you.

  • Mr Witness, good afternoon.

  • I want to ask you a few questions just following up on what you said this morning to clarify some things. On page 63, for counsel and the Court, you talked about, approximately lines 14 to 17, taking ammunition to Sierra Leone and this was concerning the shipment that arrived at the Roberts International Airport. You said, "It was the following night that we took off because we couldn't have left during the day." Can you explain to the judges why you couldn't have travelled during the day?

  • Thank you. My chief, Charles Taylor, told me that operations done in the day will be monitored through satellite, so for that reason we couldn't move during the day.

  • Okay, thank you. Then in the next page, on line 6 to 18 approximately, you were talking about - I was asking you about what you were carrying in the vehicles and you said:

    "But the jeep that we were in, there was no ammo in there, but it was in front of me escorting so when they see me they will know straight away that I was the one travelling with those trucks and there will be no embarrassment through Charles Taylor's directive."

    Can you explain what you mean when you say "there would be no embarrassment through Charles Taylor's directive"?

  • Thank you. I will say the truth and nothing but the truth. When I was moving with those trucks there will be ammos in the trucks and any time they saw me and if they were ordinary officers they will stop the vehicles to check what was in the vehicle, but any time they saw me they would know that I am the chief of operations and they knew that I was moving directly by Charles Taylor's orders, so nobody would stop me and to check my convoy. Have you got me?

  • Yes. I believe - I thought I heard you, Mr Witness, use the word "checkpoint". Were you referring to checkpoints on the road?

  • On the various roads to move from Monrovia as far as Foya. The check points that were there, at any time they saw me in the vehicle, with those cars behind me, no officer will check inside my cars because they knew that I was moving on our president's, Charles Taylor's, orders.

  • Thank you. Next, Mr Witness, there appears to be something that the record didn't get that you said. I am referring to page 82, lines 22 to 25. You were talking about this operation after the establishment of the Jungle Fire Unit from Gbarnga up to Belefuania. You said at one point, "It was at that time that we formed the [something] target operation", I believe you were talking about. What was the word that you used?

  • No baby on targets. That means no pity for women, children, old people. Everybody was considered to be enemies, so they should be targets. Do you want me to repeat that again?

  • It is quite clear, sir, thank you. Mr Marzah, you told us about carrying out executions on the orders of Charles Taylor. Sir, was Charles Taylor ever present for any execution that you witnessed?

  • He was not present, but it was the instruction that came from him that I went by. He was the president, so whatever he said to me was what I did. Nobody violated his orders and after implementing the orders that he gave me, I will go back to him and give him my salute report, to him, Charles Taylor.

  • Mr Witness, are you familiar with the faction ULIMO-J?

  • No. Since our arrival on 24 December 1989 I never mixed up myself with any other unit. I was in NPFL and I remained in the NPFL until everything came to an end.

  • I am sorry, it seems that my question wasn't clear. I am asking you if you have heard that name before: The word, the faction name, ULIMO-J. Have you heard that term?

  • Yes, when we were fighting against ULIMO in Gbarnga.

  • Thank you. I want to go and ask you whether you recall a woman from ULIMO-J, if anything happened to her?

  • It was not from ULIMO-J per se. I will repeat my statement. I told you in '85 that there was a ceremony at the time they had the interim government at the Executive Mansion. A lady was arrested as a ceremony for Charles Taylor right behind his house. That is the old White Flower, which was close to the Nigerian house.

  • I would ask you to go slower because I believe the interpretation is missing some of what you are saying and it is important that it be clear and accurate. The interpretation said, "I told you in '85". Do you recall what year it was that you were talking about?

  • I said '95. Upon our arrival in Monrovia with Charles Taylor, during the period of the interim government, that was the time our president was serving at the mansion. At that time he sent us to get a pregnant woman for a ceremony.

  • I want to stop you because I am not sure if the interpretation, or the transcript is correct. It indicated - I didn't understand you to say this, at "the time our president was serving at the mansion." Did you say the president was serving at the mansion, or who did you say was serving at the mansion?

  • When Charles Taylor was serving at the mansion during the period of the interim government. It was the - there were six presidents in the Executive Mansion, serving as one, at that time we entered in Monrovia.

  • What happened to the pregnant woman? Tell us slowly and clearly.

  • It happened one time when George Bolai [phon] and so many other people - Kennedy was at the mansion serving the interim government. That was the time he ordered us to go and hunt out for a pregnant woman from central Monrovia. At that time he was living at the old White Flower, close to the Nigerian house, in '95. The lady was used as a ceremony in this way. After the pregnant woman - I think the pregnancy was about six to seven months when we took her.

  • Your Honours, the witness said something that is not clear to the interpreter.

  • Mr Witness, the interpreter didn't hear you very clearly. Could you please repeat from the point where you say, "After the pregnant woman - I think her pregnancy was six to seven months when we took her." Please continue from there.

  • Okay. About six or seven months pregnancy. By Charles Taylor's orders I went along with Benjamin Yeaten, including some bodyguards. We arrested this woman and we put her in a car with tinted glasses. Nobody could see through. Ben took the woman to Charles Taylor's farm - Charles Taylor's fence by the White Flower. That is the old White Flower that was by the Nigerian house.

  • Witness, I am stopping you to allow the interpreter to catch up. It is good if every few sentences you take a little break for a few seconds. Also you said, "We took her inside the fence". Can you explain what you mean when you say "inside the fence"?

  • In Charles Taylor's fence at the old White Flower by the Nigerian house.

  • Okay, and slowly tell us what happened when you took her inside the fence of the old White Flower?

  • When we took her there, after two days, the third day for the woman I saw Ben with a white sheep and he brought it into the fence. At that time there was a six man council at the Executive Mansion. When we took the woman, the third day we went to the beach. At that time some of the bodyguards had already dug a pit and we placed two empty drums into the pit. Are you getting me clear? Two empty drums were placed into the pit and we stripped the woman naked and put - and we took the woman from the fence. She had clothes on, but when we reached where the pit was we placed her in the pit. He was standing, Ben was there, Peter Saikpedeh, Joe Tuah. These were all Special Forces. They were all there, including some bodyguards. I cannot recall all of them. They were standing by. Then we placed the woman in the pit. We were all standing there and then the woman was pleading with him and from there he said, "Forget it, they are not going to do anything to you." They left the woman there standing in --

  • When you said, Mr Witness, that the woman was pleading and then he said "forget it", who were you talking about?

  • I am talking about Charles Taylor. The woman was directly pleading with Charles Taylor whilst she was standing straight in the pit showing up her hands and then he told the woman, saying, "Put your hands together", and then we will take her from there. After the woman straightened her hands we put the sand over her and then until the sand covered her up to this area and at that time the woman was crying. Myself, I was present there. I am talking about '95. That was the time we entered Monrovia. So, when the woman was completely covered with the dirt, they brought the white sheep from Charles Taylor's fence and we took it to where this women was covered with the dirt and then he held the sheep, and then we were all fighting over the sheep and then we divided that sheep amongst us, and that was the ceremony for his government. From there, when we were ready to go to the mansion, some of the council members would be afraid. They will be afraid to go to the mansion. So, that is the ceremony that I am talking about. Do you get me?

  • Sir, when you say - so that everyone here understands you - when you say the woman was covered with the dirt, up to what point was she covered? How high was the dirt?

  • Was it covered with the sand, with the dirt, with the death?

  • We covered her with the sand, with the same sand, the same sand that we dug up from the pit. That was the same place that they took the white sheep to and that was where we were fighting over the sheep. So, even before you could get a small piece of it, it was not something that we - it was a ceremony. It was a sacrifice. Do you get me?

  • Also the witness indicated "we covered her up to this area". What area?

  • Behind Charles Taylor's house where the beach is. That is the old White Flower by Nigerian house.

  • Mr Witness, listen. We want to know, you said you covered the woman up to "this area". What area? You were indicating somewhere.

  • The sand stopped the woman and she was covered and it was equal to the ground level as though you were burying somebody. She was covered with the sand and it was equal to the level of the ground and she remained under the sand and they brought the sheep. We all fought over the sheep and the whole place was covered. You get me clear? What I am saying - let me just show you the example. There was a deep hole and we placed empty drums inside the pit and the level of the ground was equal to the level of the drum and it was from inside that same pit that we placed the woman and the woman was standing straight in the hole. Do you understand me? She was standing in the hole and then his close bodyguard, Momoh Jibba, Joe Tuah, Peter Saikpedeh, they went. We were all standing and then they covered - the sand that was dug from the hole, they put the sand over the woman and it was equal to the level of the ground, the same way. Do you understand me? And from there they brought the woman - they brought a white sheep where the woman was covered with the sand and he himself held the sheep by the horn and then we all rushed on the sheep. We fought over the sheep. Each and every one of us carried pieces of the sheep and that was a ceremony for Charles Taylor's government. That is what I am saying. Do you understand that?

  • Thank you. Mr Witness, just so everyone is clear, when the woman was placed in the pit, in the hole, was her head below the ground, or above the ground?

  • The hole - two drums, two empty drums. Do you know the metal drum, the round drum?

  • Counsel has asked a simple question. Was the lady's head below the ground, or above the ground when she was in the pit?

  • It was under the ground and the hole was over her head and her head was below the level of the hole, so the pit was as high like this window.

  • I understand now. Thank you, Mr Witness. Mr Koumjian.

  • Mr Witness, to be absolutely clear, you are saying the woman was buried alive; is that correct?

  • Where was Charles Taylor as the sand was being put in the pit?

  • He was the first person to take the sand and put it over inside the hole before the boys could send the sand over the woman. He himself was the first person that took some sand with his hand and put it in the hole before we started sending the sand into the hole.

  • Thank you. Mr Witness, you talked to us about a death squad battalion, or death squad. Can you tell us did you ever receive any orders, or information from the death squad - excuse me, I will try that again. First of all are you familiar with Camp Carter?

  • Again?

  • Do you know Camp Carter?

  • Carter Camp. Carter Camp in Harbel. Carter Camp in Harbel. About '90 Carter Camp massacre was done by Charles Taylor directly through the Special Forces chief security commander, Benjamin Yeaten. Benjamin Yeaten went to me behind [indiscernible] and he said that there were some civilians in Carter Camp, they were in collaboration with the soldiers who were in Camp Schefflein. He said they will pass through the bushes to go and relay information to the AFL at Camp Schefflein, so he gave instruction that none of those people should leave there, all of them should be executed. At the time Ben went to my residence at Schefflein Highway I was sick and then I think he and his driver, Peter Saikpedeh, and his Special Forces too, they led some groups at that time and then people said at that time that Mosquito, Christopher Varmoh, he was a small boy, they were assigned at 15 Gate. At that time Mosquito was not brave against human being, so they went there along with Joe Tuah and they carried out the execution and when he left there he came to my area where Paul Weah, my former commander - he is now late. He came to talk to me. He went there and said all the people who were there have been executed and then Paul Weah said, "Why didn't you bring some of the children?" Then he said, "You know what Charles Taylor's orders are. If he tell you something, you go and don't do that, it will not be nice for you. The people that we killed were more than 600 at Carter Camp."

    The same thing happened at Dupo Road [phon]. At Dupo Road it was Sam Larto and the same Maduna Bwua who carried out the massacre again and from there, they left there against the AFL and then when they left there, the same night that they came to Sorklini [phon], it was Benjamin Yeaten, Joe Tuah, including some Special Forces, yes. That is the thing that I know and I am saying the truth and nothing but the truth. Any questions?

  • Yes, sir, thank you.

  • Just pause, Mr Koumjian. Mr Interpreter, you have a few times today used the expression - you have said "late". Do you mean the person in question is dead?

  • That would be the more correct English.

  • Thank you, your Honour.

  • One question about the Camp Carter massacre. Mr Witness, do you know if that massacre was blamed on anybody else?

  • Yes, after that massacre was done he left the blame on the AFL and from there they left the blame on Prince Johnson and the time Prince Johnson went to attack --

  • Your Honours, could the witness kindly repeat that area again.

  • Mr Witness, you have speeded up again. Please repeat the last part of your question from the point where you said "the time Prince Johnson went to attack."

  • Perhaps, your Honour, it went beyond my question. I can ask another question if you like.

  • Yes, Mr Koumjian, please do so.

  • Sir, you indicated that the blame was put on the AFL. Do you know how that was done? How did they put the blame on the AFL for the Camp Carter massacre?

  • For NPFL not to be blamed for that instruction, so the blame was cast on AFL because you cannot go and say it was the NPFL that massacred, because at that time, if we did, the civilians that were around us will go against us.

  • Thank you. My question is do you know how they were able to make it look like it was the AFL? If you don't know, say so.

  • No, I don't know. The only thing that I heard next was when I heard over radio that the NPFL massacred. That was the time that Charles Taylor said that it was not the NPFL but it was the AFL that carried out the massacre.

  • You said that after the massacre someone - you said "when he left there he came to my area".

  • I said Benjamin Yeaten left and went to my area at Harbel. I mean Camp Schefflein Highway where my former commander, who is now dead, the late Paul Weah, came to explain to me about this massacre. That was how I came to know for the second time. That was when he came for me, for us to go. But when he came, the initial trip, I was sick. I didn't go. But after they went on the mission and the mission was successful and when he return he was explaining this to me and my battalion commander, Paul Weah, on Schefflein Highway after Joru Town. That was what I said.

  • Thank you. Sir, do you know of an area named Kammantahun? The spelling is --

  • I will just spell it for the record, K-A-M-M-A-N-T-A-H-U-N. Have you ever been to Kammantahun?

  • Yes, I passed through Kamma Town when the LURD were based in Kolahun and they put up defensives at Popolahun. That was the time Superman, Abu Keita, they went to visit me in Vahun.

  • Thank you. Do you know what year it was that this happened?

  • [Witness shakes head].

  • Okay, thank you. It was during the time you were fighting LURD?

  • Yes, there was a time that LURD came near there and settled in Kolahun.

  • What happened when you passed through Kammantahun?

  • You see, in Kammantahun I was based in Vahun and later when Superman, Abu Keita, that was when Ben sent for them in Vahun and he said that the forces that were in Kolahun, to go through their defensive was very difficult so he said I should go and base at Kammantahun. So, I left Vahun and I went to base in Kammantahun to face Popolahun. That was where Superman, Abu Keita, went to me and then we left and went to battle against the LURD in Popolahun, but to my surprise there was one Peanut Butter, commonly known at Adolphus Dolo. Ben left Vahun, on that very day we went to attack Popolahun. Peanut Butter take the route from Popolahun to enter. I took the straight line with those men for us to enter, but on our return I left Peanut Butter and others behind and I went ahead, because most of the Gissi and the Gbani were used to me and the women then I had was a Gbani and Gissi, so most times they used to take their rescues at my CP and I was hunting for my wife's family from Kolahun. So, most of these civilians will always come to my own CP and if I had anything, I used to share with them. So, Ben went there along with his bodyguards and they started executing the people at our rear, so they were --

  • Your Honours, the witness is still going too fast.

  • Witness, again you have speeded up. Little bit slower please.

  • Okay, okay. So, when I was based in Kammantahun, most of the Gbandi and the Foya always sought refuge at my CP because I married someone from among them, one of their daughters. So, when we left, Abu Keita, Superman, when we left and went to attack Popolahun to break their defenses, we went there at two different times. Ben started asking me, "How is Superman's operation?" I said, "Oh, chief, Superman actually he is fighting well. I have not seen any problem with him. Today at the battle we were at the main road and I have not seen any strange things with him." And he said, "Be careful." The third day Ben went there. He went behind us at Kammantahun. He - over 80 or more people, he started executing all of them. Some of them he did not execute them with a knife, or with a gun. He took rusty iron steel rod from broken houses. He passed it through their stomach and it came out from the other end, from their bellies, from this end to the other end. Sometimes he will line up four/five human beings and they will hit them with the stick on their heads. So, I left - I was at the front line when I heard. Abu Keita, among all of them I was the senior officer. We got there and I saw one of my bodyguards, Heavy D [phon], one of my bodyguard commanders, and he said, "Chief, the director, Benjamin Yeaten, he came here and he has killed all these people, the people whom he said we should look for. He has killed all of them." I said, "What are you talking about?" Actually when I went the whole place was polluted. I was disturbed. There was no way to eat food.

    I went up the hills outside the town and I was sitting down. From there I saw Peanut Butter too coming from the front line and he said, "But this place was controlled by Zigzag. How could Zigzag massacre all of these people?", and he too passed. When he passed he went straight to town in Monrovia at the time Charles Taylor was at Arthington. He said, "Yes, sir, Mr President" - that is Charles now. He said, "The civilians with Zigzag, he has killed all of them." Charles Taylor shouted at him. I am talking about our present junior senator in Liberia. He said, "The thing that happened at the front line, you don't have a right to come and tell me publicly among people. If you don't want to serve my government you can go anywhere." But after two days, when my wife came from the old road market, she called me and she said, "Oh, Peanut Butter and your name is all over Monrovia. Peanut Butter said you killed all our people." I said, "What are you saying?" She said, "Peanut Butter said you have killed all of the people." I said, "No, I did not do it. It was Ben who did it." I said, "In fact the way the people were executed down to the children, I am panic stricken. I don't even know what to do. In fact, I am coming to town."

    The next day I went to Monrovia. At that time Charles Taylor was at White Flower at his new house. When I went there Ben took me in the fence and said, "My son, that man, you don't know what he is doing, forget it. Forget about what has happened." A red motorbike, Yamaha, his daughter was using it, he took it and gave it to me. He said, "Nothing will happen. Peanut Butter does not know what he is doing. Whatever they saw at the front line is what they will talk about." And I said, "Chief, it was not me that did it." He said, "Forget it." He gave me the motorbike. He gave a car to Benjamin Yeaten and he gave two other Isuzu cars Idi Amin and Pablo. That was how I knew about the massacre in Kammantahun.

  • Mr Witness, to clarify a few of those details. Peanut Butter, do you know his real name? Can you say it for the record, the real name of Peanut Butter?

  • Adolphus Dolo. I said the junior senator for Nimba County. Adolphus Dolo. He is now in Monrovia. He is a junior senator.

  • Sir, you talked about coming to Monrovia and going inside the fence at White Flower, and a conversation with someone and the person gave you a red motorbike, and gave a vehicle to Benjamin Yeaten and to some other people.

  • I did not say someone, I said Charles Taylor. I did not say someone, I said Charles Taylor. He said, "My son, forget about what has happened. Peanut Butter doesn't know what he is talking about", but I said Charles Taylor later - he, Charles Taylor, gave me the Yamaha 100, a Honda, a motorbike and he gave a car to Benjamin Yeaten, a station wagon, and he gave two white Isuzu pick-ups, motorcycle, one to Pablo and one to Idi Amin. That is what I said.

  • Mr Witness, what did you understand was the reason that Charles Taylor gave you the motorcycle and gave the others the vehicle?

  • For us not to broadcast the name of his chief security, that he was the one who carried out the massacre, that he, Ben, carried out the massacre. Once they said it was me, nothing would happen. I should go back on assignment and that was what happened. Nothing happened at all as a result of that massacre.

  • Mr Witness, you recently mentioned the name of Superman. Who was Superman?

  • Superman, he was a little boy, Liberian, from Margidi County, but when we entered Freetown in Sierra Leone for the second phase, they were there as senior commander there.

  • Do you know what happened to Superman? What was his ultimate fate?

  • At the end it happened when we were transporting the weapons from Freetown after the UN had been disarmed. We were transporting the weapons from Sierra Leone to Vahun. Then my assignment was not there. Morris Kallon, FOC, Issa and some other RUF staff, they went that day with 103 barrel, 106 barrel, with some weapons. When they went they took a paper and gave it to Ben and they said the paper was from the internet, that Superman had gone to Guinea and connived with Lansana Conte. The way he came here was to convince those men to overthrow. From then on Ben told me that he received an order from Charles Taylor.

  • Your Honour, can he repeat that last word. To what?

  • Mr Witness, the interpreter didn't get you, so I am going to stop and ask you a few questions before I come back to where you stopped. First of all, the events you are talking about, do you know what year this happened?

  • That one happened when Issa was in control of the RUF. I told you I don't know - I am not educated.

  • When this happened you said, "They took a paper and gave it to Ben". Who gave the paper to Ben?

  • It was Issa, Issa. That day Issa, Morris Kallon, FOC, Al CO Junior, they were the ones who took the document and showed it to Ben. They said they got it from internet.

  • After they gave the document to Ben, what happened?

  • When they gave this document to Ben we were in Vahun. Super, Abu Keita, we were operating together. We changed underclothes and did everything together, but one evening Ben called me. He called Shy Shooter and some of his bodyguards, along with Dr Magona. He is a Sierra Leonean, a professional doctor. All of us boarded Dr Magona's jeep and some of the men went into the calibre pick-up and we left all Superman's bodyguards in Vahun, like the High Command, Salami, the King Junior and some others. We left them in Vahun. When we were going in this jeep, Superman was having one other doctor that was assigned with him. Whilst we were moving, before approaching Bah, going towards Bomi Hills, Ben went in front and called me. He said, "That man, Taylor says we should execute him, but after his execution we should be highly protected. We should take his hand, his hand for him as FOC." I said, "But Chief Ben" --

  • Your Honours, can the witness repeat that last bit.

  • If your Honours would like, I will pick up:

  • The interpreter missed the end of your answer, so I am going to pick it up where we got your answer with some more questions. First of all, you said that Ben said, "We should take his hand, his hand for FOC." Can you explain to the Court what "FOC" meant?

  • I told you the hand. Okay, Superman, this part of his finger, the centre one, he used it for juju, so he had on a certain ring on them. So, afterwards Ben told us that when we execute Superman, Charles Taylor says we should make sure that Charles Taylor - that Superman does not die. We should carry that arm to make - so that he can see and make sure. That is what we call FOC.

  • The interpretation, Mr Witness, said, "Charles Taylor - that Superman does not die." Was the order that Superman does not die, or was the order to kill Superman?

  • The order was to kill Superman and take the arm to him and that was for our ceremony in Ben's seat.

  • The term "FOC" that some of us aren't familiar with, what is an FOC in general? What does the term mean?

  • Okay, when we talk about FOC in Liberian English, for instance this table in front of me you say, "Zigzag, go and make way to bust that table", at least something that you can use to identify this table. You would tell me that when you go and bust that table, the mark that is there, or the thing that is on that table, that I can use to know that I really destroyed it, so when I carried it to you then that is the FOC.

  • Okay. Was Superman killed?

  • Yes. Superman, when we were going we were all in the jeep along with Shy Shooter. After we got on the road, we went to toilet and he called me. He said, "When I get down, when I shoot in the bush when I get down I will say, 'Oh, I have killed a monkey. I have killed a monkey'. There are many, people will come and when he gets there we will be able to fire after him." When he said that, I and Shy Shooter were in the same car.

    While we and Superman were moving, at Tagbah [phon] going towards Bomi Hills in the car, Ben stopped the jeep. He went into the bush and shot two single barrel rounds and he said, "Oh, this monkey looks like a real baboon. I have shot it, but it is not coming down. You people come. You people come before it gets away." I got down and Superman got down for us to rush. Shy Shooter opened one magazine shot at the back of Superman and he dropped, including the doctor that was assigned with him.

    Then we went to make sure for Charles Taylor to make sure that Superman has actually died. We cut off his arm that he had requested for and we severed it. We took off his head. We opened his chest. We took out his liver. The liver was for our ceremony in Ben's yard at the banana bush where we were with Dogolea. We took it from there. From there I and Ben entered into the fence and he left me there and entered into Charles Taylor's house with Superman's hand wrapped in a tissue, but he did not come outside with it.

    After he came back and we went back to the banana bush to go and cook the liver of Superman before he gave us 200 US dollars. He said that was our secret money that Charles Taylor has given us. He went and bought some drinks and things and after we had finished eating Superman's liver we dispersed from there. That is what they call FOC.

  • You said that you cut off his arm and you were pointing to I believe your wrist. Is that the point where you cut off the hand?

  • Yes, right here for him. To know that that was Superman, the ring that was on his finger. On his two fingers.

  • Your Honours, a correction. The ring that was on his short finger.

  • The interpreter is behind you, Mr Witness. So, you were talking about the head. What did you do with the head? Go ahead, please, slowly.

  • I said the head, the head of Superman, we severed it, but we did not take it to town to destroy the confidence. So, we took the head and drove in the car for 10 or 15 minutes. We walked in the bush for a little distance and abandoned the head there and we came back into the car and carried the arm, yes.

  • You indicated that you cut open the chest and you took out what you called the liver and took that for a ceremony at Ben's house?

  • And you were pointing to the centre of your chest. What do you mean by the liver?

  • The heart. The heart. The heart. The human heart. The human heart, yes.

  • You say, "We ate it". Who ate the heart of Superman?

  • I took part, we ate it, Ben ate some, all of us who were on that mission, because of some kind of reason when we do it we have to eat it at all cost.

  • Then you indicated that someone gave you 200 dollars. Just to be clear, who gave you the 200 dollars?

  • Ben. He said it was Charles Taylor who gave it to him. At the time that he had deposited Superman's arm in Charles Taylor's house, he came out with the money and distributed it among us. 200 dollars each.

  • Now, you indicated when beginning to tell us about the killing of Superman that just before you, Abu Keita and Superman were together in operations?

  • At that time, who were you fighting against?

  • At that time we were fighting against LURD. We were fighting against LURD rebels that were based in Kolahun, yes.

  • Thank you. Now earlier in your testimony, Mr Witness, you mentioned the name of Jungle you identified as Daniel Tamba. Do you know the fate of Jungle?

  • Yes, I know what happened to Jungle. Jungle, he was one of the key men operating under me from the directive from Charles Taylor. He used to transport the ammo and arms to Freetown, but the execution of Mosquito then when Ganta fell they sent for Jungle for him to go and attack Ganta. When he went there, Ben ordered Calaba Nyande - he is from Freetown. He is a Sierra Leonean boy. When Jungle was engaging the enemies, Ben gave instruction for Calaba Nyande to open the calibre behind Jungle. They said, "Oh, that is Jungle going there". Daniel Tamba, I call him Jungle. He said, "That is Jungle going there". He said, "I told you to open the calibre", and then they opened the calibre and he entered the back of the boy's head and it opened his skull and it dropped. That is how he died.

  • Your Honour, first of all the name Nyande is spelt N-Y-A-N-D-E. That is the name that the witness has identified as a Sierra Leonean.

  • He is a Sierra Leonean. He is a Sierra Leonean.

  • MR Witness, so you are saying that you - how do you know about the killing of Jungle? Were you present, or did someone tell you?

  • You see, Sam Bockarie, Abu Keita, Superman, I, Jungle, we were in the same group. The bodyguards, we just used to exchange them. I got to know about the death of Jungle when Ben sent for me from Singe. He said, "An enemy has killed Jungle, so they want you to go there."

    Then the superintendent of Nimba County announced over the radio that enemies were advancing in Vahun. I was worried. When I went to him Charles Taylor said, "If an enemy is advancing, you cannot be a hero and then the enemy will destroy your county." Then I said, "Old man, I am willing to go there", so he gave me a green Isuzu pick-up with some ammo. I took some of my bodyguards to go and attack Ganta.

  • I am just trying to get a little clarity. My question was just were you present when Jungle was killed, or did someone tell you about it? I understand you to be saying someone told you?

  • No, I was not there, but I was informed by one of our bodyguards.

  • What was the name of the bodyguard that told you about the killing of Jungle?

  • They called him CO Pepe. CO Pepe. I have forgotten his real name.

  • Okay. Did CO Pepe indicate how he knew about the killing of Jungle? Was he there?

  • Yes, at the time that Jungle was released to Lofa Bridge he was assigned with me. Jungle said Pepe should go along with him, so I gave him half of the men that were with me for them to go with Jungle on that Ganta attack.

  • Your Honour, one of my colleagues indicates that CO Pepe is P-E-P-E.

  • Mr Koumjian, I don't wish to interrupt, but really I am looking at the testimony. I can't make sense of this. Just listen to this. I am reading from page 119 regarding the death of Jungle:

    "Ben gave instruction for Calaba to open the calibre behind Jungle. 'That is the Jungle going'. That Daniel Tamba, I call him Jungle. He said, 'Thanks, that is the Jungle going'. I told him to open the calibre and then they opened the calibre and he entered the back of the boy's head and it opened and his [indiscernible] and it dropped. That is how he died."

  • Thank you, your Honour.

  • Sir, we did not get it clear on the transcript.

  • I will repeat. I told you --

  • Mr Koumjian, ask the question again.

  • Let us go over it slowly and just give me one or two sentences then I will ask the next question, because we want to make sure it is written down correctly, okay?

  • Now, what did CO Pepe tell you about the killing of Jungle?

  • CO Pepe told me - he was one of our soldiers. He is still alive. He said, "Chief ..." - at the time that I left Monrovia I met him at the CNN camp. He said, "Chief, the place where you are going, they killed Jungle intentionally. When you go there, you must be careful". That is Pepe from my unit in Singe. Then he started to explain how Jungle was going to engage the enemy. Then Ben gave instructions to Calaba Nyande. He said they should open the calibre behind Jungle.

  • I want to make sure that we have gotten it written down correctly. When you say "Open the calibre", what do you mean by "the calibre"?

  • The heavy weapon that was mounted on the pick-up. A heavy weapon mounted on the pick-up. He said he should shoot it behind. Then Nyande knew - knows Jungle, "I know the group he was with", and he told Ben, "That group that is over there is not an enemy group. It is Jungle's group", before Ben ordered him that, "I told you you should shoot that weapon". That is what I am saying.

  • So then when the weapon was fired, did it hit Jungle?

  • It hit him at the back of his head and it penetrated through the forehead. That is how he died.

  • Thank you. Now, sir, do you know the name Johnny Paul Koroma?

  • Yes, I know the name. I heard the name.

  • Do you know what the fate was of Johnny Paul Koroma?

  • I only heard a few stories about Johnny Paul Koroma, but it did not happen in my presence.

  • Who talked to you about what happened to Johnny Paul Koroma? Who told you about it?

  • It was a battle group of navy division called Sweet Candy, fighting under the navy division under Roland Duoh. Sweet Candy.

  • Sweet Candy is the name of a soldier, correct?

  • Yes. He has his real name but I can't recall now, but I can remember Sweet Candy.

  • What did Sweet Candy tell you about the fate of Johnny Paul Koroma?

  • During the time --

  • Your Honours, can he repeat the beginning of his answer? It is not very clear.

  • Witness, the interpreter requires you to repeat the beginning of your answer. Start again, please.

  • I will ask the question again:

  • What did Sweet Candy tell you about how Johnny Paul Koroma died?

  • Have we established that --

  • I thought he said that earlier that he heard he was killed:

  • Sir, can you tell us what did Sweet Candy tell you about Johnny Paul Koroma?

  • Yes, Sweet Candy during the time we were preparing for the general attack I was not at Foya. It was Sweet Candy, the battle group for navy division. He went to me to [indiscernible]. He said, "Top Bra, you know what has happened?", and I said, "No". I said, "Look at me". I saw Johnny Paul Koroma's jacket on him. I saw his name written on it. He said, "Oh, the order came from ..." --

  • Before you talk about the order, you were talking about the jacket and you pointed to something. First of all, had you ever seen that jacket before?

  • Yes, I saw the jacket before. My second time to see that jacket was when Sweet Candy was having it on with Johnny Paul's "JP" written on it before he explained to me about the death of Johnny Paul.

  • You said it was the second time you saw the jacket. Who was wearing it the first time you saw the jacket?

  • The first time I saw the jacket, during the invasion when we and Eddie Kanneh and others were going I saw that jacket with one other bodyguard of Johnny Paul called Rambo. He was holding it with some kind of a bag and he said it was their chief's jacket. Yes, the second time of seeing this jacket was when Sweet Candy was having it on.

  • And then you said --

  • Mr Koumjian, is that the proof of death of Johnny Paul that someone was wearing his jacket? I just wish to follow, because this witness has - you have asked him a number of times --

  • Excuse me, I am talking to the lawyer.

  • I think he is going to continue with the explanation.

  • Yes, but I am asking you for clarification, Mr Koumjian.

  • We are talking about the death of Johnny Paul Koroma, are we not?

  • And the question you asked the witness was what did he hear about the death.

  • So far he has not said anything other than this jacket. Am I following?

  • Yes, you are, your Honour:

  • Now, Mr Witness, after you saw Sweet Candy with the jacket, what did Sweet Candy tell you?

  • Sweet Candy said that there was an order from Charles Taylor for them to execute Johnny Paul. Then I asked him, "Man, what are you talking about?" He said, "Well, you can't see the man's jacket on me?" Then I saw the jacket with Johnny Paul's name written on the pocket, but I was not there how they executed him or how they did it, but Sweet Candy explained to me that it was an order from Charles Taylor and that they have executed Johnny Paul. He is a betrayer.

  • Can you please permit me to use the gents?

  • Please assist the witness. Thank you.

  • [In the absence of the witness]

  • Your Honour, there are a few spellings I could give in the mean time.

  • Thank you, Mr Koumjian. Please do that.

  • The witness mentioned a Dr Magona. That is M-A-G-O-N-A. He also mentioned, I believe referring to bodyguards of Bockarie, Salami S-A-L-A-M-I and High Command spelled - it is two words, High Command. And there was - the witness talked about calibre, he used that to describe a gun, and I believe the spelling is C-A-L-I-B-E-R [sic].

  • I am not going to say anything.

  • Excuse me, I think it is a difference between American and British spellings.

  • I think that is all it is. I think we are talking about the same thing.

  • Thank you, your Honour.

  • [In the presence of the witness]

  • Please proceed, Mr Koumjian.